Forum: Darwnist Ideology

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Dawkins just discredits the ridiculous claim nobody ever made ....

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Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Thanks Sy...you just stole the crown shared by Dan and Hambre for funniest guy at Evc[This message has been edited by Mammuthus, 02-23-2004]

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Deciding a name for something as basic as uh the diversity of organisms, only 15 years ago, suggests negligence obviously.

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Quantum mechanics and epigenetics were not known 30 years ago..those damn Darwinists..covering up everyones eyes

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If you don't like the term Darwinist ideology, then what other word would you like to use to describe this phenomenon of Darwinism influencing intellectual climate of opinion, both personally and societally?

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How about this for another word? BullshitReally Sy...watching Quetzal and mark24 rip you to shreds and then your pathetic repetitive ignorance disorder makes you a truly pitiful figure. Most creationists by now would be tempted to actually read something about the subject to spare themeselves the humiliation (either that or crawl into a corner in a fetal position)..obviously the Nganjuk school system churns out some great success stories in obliviousness.Hey, I saw the forward of a book recently..it had the word "the" in it...maybe you can use that in your conspiracy babbling.

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I see that you rewrote your post of the month nomination...

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I wanted to nominate you for Stupid Post of the Month but the category does not exist...must be a Darwinist conspiracy to suppress the fact that you are ignorant...it must be a massive conspiracy considering you are probably the least informed person on this site.

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It is a pattern among evolutionists to invent lawyer ploys to sabotage investigation of Darwinist ideology

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In order for one to investigate..one actually has to do some investigating to be sure that what they say is not utter bullshit. Guess what? You don't even want to read what anyone has ever said even if it might mean you could potentially find information that supports your blathering. I assume you don't want to "investigate" because you know you will find out you are wrong in every way and then you won't have anything to do in Nganjuk except cry in your milk.

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Obviously you all are just pontificating your authority to suppress investigation into an issue you don't like to hear about, the scientific demerits of Darwinism, and it's relationship to social Darwinism.

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Well funny enough, investigation has not been surpressed at all. In fact a simple thing called "reading" (look it up Sy..oh forgot, you might have to read to find out what that entails ) would show that people look into exactly the subject you claim is suppressed..for example.In the Name of Eugenics: Genetics and the Uses of Human Heredity
by Daniel J. Kevles

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But for anyone willing to entertain the notions, the evidence is very broad, and straightforward.

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For anyone willing to read and educate themselves, the evidence for what Syamsu says is restricted to his blathering. He actually does a bigger disservice to the cause of exposing the misuse of science by society by being such an uninformed twit as his ignorance actually distracts from the actual issues which are important....but I hear he can do a mean wash.

Why don't you read Dawkin's yourself? Is it so hard for you to read? There is help available for people with reading disabilities.

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I wasn't saying that everyone who accepts Darwinist theory as true suppresses investigation of the relationship of Darwinism to Social Darwinism, I was just saying that people here do, and on talk.origins.

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So you have been lying all this time i.e. making broad claims about entire scientific disciplines and now saying you did not? In any case, even if it were true (and it is not) what difference would it make what happens here? This is a debate forum and not an investigators source of information.

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Like I said before in this thread, no serious intellectual ignores the link of Darwinism to social darwinism because of the history of the holocaust

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No serious intellectual makes statements about subjects in which they are not well read...so by definition, you are not a serious intellectual.

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You give a title of a book, but you don't argue what's in it, what's more elsewhere you make argument to the effect that any discussion of the relationship is meaningless, and you support others who proudly make the most inane simplistic statements as if that settles all that is to be said about the relationship.

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I have brought this same book up many times. I have also discussed its content in various threads in which you have participated. You have universally ignored it and have never made the effort to find out about the book or the thousands of references directly to the publications of people involved in the eugenics movement that it contains. So you are the one here making inane statements.

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Anytime you want to go into the usual let's ignore Syamsu from now on mode of argument, go ahead.

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I'll make a deal with you. You go out and actually read some of the literature on eugenics and its origins and then come back and debate and I promise to be nicer to you.

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As before, people who mess up threads I start with meaningless, vitriolic, inane and simply false argument, simply go to talk.origins where you will find much more of that kind of stuff.

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Hey, you started it all by not preparing to back up your statements with fact...it is our pleasure to make fun of you for it.

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"The influence on the German industrialists and militarists of the first World War was from a form of philosophy that owed everything to Herbert Spencer and the German Romantics, and literally nothing at all to biological Darwinism"
(John Wilkins talk.origins)

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Hmmm taking quotes from Talkorigins now? How about we bring back the quotes made by you about Bosnian muslims being genetic degenerates? But humor me...how is the above statement wrong? And not based on your assertions but from credible independent sources.

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I don't consider myself a serious intellectual of course, I haven't the time or sense of purpose to become one.

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blink blink blink...did you really mean to just say this?

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What book I would love to read is a book on the systemacy of Natural Selection theory. A book which starts with positig a unit of reproduction, and then layer after layer introduces other concepts, such as competition, population, etc. in a formalised abstracted way.

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The Principles of Population Genetics, Daniel Hartl and Andrew Clark
Get a copy and live your dream. Or perhaps Evolutionary Biology by Douglas Futuyma. There are lots of basic textbooks as opposed to pop literature.

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It is all amateur level in Darwinism, and that's about my level.

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There is a difference between an informed amateur and someone who does not know anything...you obviously failed to grasp this concept.

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On the other hand creationists have been mainly been the defenders of common values

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I thought they defended creationism as being the truth? What support do you have for this statement?

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such as equality

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What support do you have for this statement? The christians claim anyone who disagrees with them (including other christians) are hell bound morons..how equal is that?

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, the wonder of creativity

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I will give you that..I have never seen a group with as many varied and ridiculous "just so stories" with no evidence or logical support as creationists...very creative.

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, freedom of choice

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Fundamentalists loathe freedom of choice. They wish to force their dogma on everyone else. So this is plainly wrong.

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, that they have provided and continue to provide an extremely valuable service to more advanced science in providing an independent framework of thought

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Name a single creationist that has ever made a scientific contribution based on creationism or describe a single scientific discovery that has EVER benefitted from creationism..the answer, none.

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, which is routinely used by scientists as an important referencepoint to explore the more fundamental aspects of their theories.

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Yet another unsupported statement...worse, there is only counter-evidence for this absurd statement.You know, Darwinsterrier got banned by Adminimoose for violation of forum guidelines but he seems perfectly willing to let a jackass like Syamsu get away with making unsupported assertions and not debating in good faith as he pleases...nice moderating How about forcing Syamsu to actually back up his statements as opposed to repeating them endlessly?

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The post you are replying to contained a reference that backs up my assessment.

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No, it contains a bunch of half assed opinions translated from German. And did you know that forum guidelines state that you should not just post links but should state how they support your arguments? I guess that is something else you never read either.Anyway,Since you are so repetitive, I will be as well..Support the following

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On the other hand creationists have been mainly been the defenders of common values
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I thought they defended creationism as being the truth? What support do you have for this statement?

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such as equality
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What support do you have for this statement? The christians claim anyone who disagrees with them (including other christians) are hell bound morons..how equal is that?

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, the wonder of creativity
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I will give you that..I have never seen a group with as many varied and ridiculous "just so stories" with no evidence or logical support as creationists...very creative.

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, freedom of choice
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Fundamentalists loathe freedom of choice. They wish to force their dogma on everyone else. So this is plainly wrong.

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, that they have provided and continue to provide an extremely valuable service to more advanced science in providing an independent framework of thought
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Name a single creationist that has ever made a scientific contribution based on creationism or describe a single scientific discovery that has EVER benefitted from creationism..the answer, none.

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, which is routinely used by scientists as an important referencepoint to explore the more fundamental aspects of their theories.
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Yet another unsupported statement...worse, there is only counter-evidence for this absurd statement.

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Where are the independent appraissals of ecology, and extinction saying that they are well developed disciplines?

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Quetzal and I have given you more than enough materials to read on the subject to get an independent appraisal. Until you read them you should post less and think more...you have that ratio badly skewed.

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After ignoring my responses for ages, he finally established that he what he means is that creationists promote these things when it comes to promoting creationism, and not at other times.

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heh heh, I would have figured our resident guy who thinks RIF stands for reading is foolish, would have claimed you never asked him and when pressed claim that he does not have time to be an intellectual.If you bonked DT over the head with a stone, smothered him with a chloroform soaked rag, buried him under 100 meters of dirt, he would still post more informative, well thought, and interesting posts than Syamsu....and this is who Moose wants to protect?

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and now you are pedanticly insulted cause I don't answer your lurid vitriol or halfbaked satire.

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Oh, so that is what they call "questions" in Nganjuk...it must be a very lonely place.

You have been given dozens of references that contradict what you have said. You have not read ANY OF THEM. You have thus lost the argument by being a willfully stupid ass. You might consider removing your head from your rectum and actually beginning to debate in good faith, not a strong point among creationists.

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You have randomly referenced about a dozen science papers, obviously this falls well short of an appraissal, and doesn't meaningfully contradict what I said.

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And every one of the articles refutes what you said..but how would you know? You never read them. I referenced two specific books and Quetzal many more...but how would you know? You never read them. You don't know if anything we cited supports or invalidates your assertions.

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The sickening talk about rectum, ass etc. has to stop, you are going way overboard with your foul mouth.

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Not as overboard as you have gone with your willful ignorance and bad faith debating...I'll stop telling you to pull your head out of your butt when you actually get off your lazy rump, inform yourself on the subjects being debated, and back up your assertions or retract them for lack of support. You assertions made out of ignorance is what has to stop...you have the foulest mouth of all..you are the shame of Nganjuk.

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If somebody had argued the same kind of thing about gravity theory as I have about Darwinism, I would have a good laugh about it, and then dismissed it outright.

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so your saying that if you argued about gravity as stupidly as you argue about Darwinism we can laugh at you...thanks but we beat you to the punch...what a knucklehead

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That you resort to tricks like piling paperwork on me (a common trick of lawyers),

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That you resort to tricks like willfully ignoring the mountains of literature on the subject you are debating (a common creationist trick) is a sign that you have no case...By the way, please describe the theory of gravity, the evidence that supports it, and how the conclusions were derived. After all, since you are comparing it with your self proclaimed familiarity with Darwin's writings I am sure you would be willing to regail us with the extensive research you have done on the theory of gravity.

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Again your vitriol has to stop it's gone far enough already. This might have been different if I hadn't provided references for the demerits of Darwinism, but I have, so it's completely unwarranted.

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You have provided nothing. You have only refused to read anything that could either support or refute your arguemnts. Your link was not evidence but a badly translated and out of date list of opinions. Until you read a single piece of primary literature or any of the basic textbooks which are used to train scientists in evolution and ecology (some of which Queztal and I have referenced for you since you are too much of a lazy ass to find them yourself) I will continue to insist that you pull your head out of your butt and do some work. If as you admitted yourself, you lack the ability to be an "intellectual" (understatement of the century)...then you should shut the hell up. Otherwise go inform yourself and debate in good faith from an informed position.

Hey Mr. Hambre..here comes response 23.

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Interesting subjects IMO, which aren't discussed elsewhere on the forum

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Yes, interesting subjects that you were completely unprepared to debate...even unwilling to read about even though you started the thread.

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and because it's so credible you have to mess up the discussion in stead of just being able to dismiss it as the ranting of a loon.

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If we did not talk to you, nobody would.