Holistic Doctors, and medicine

RR, listen up. I am now 72. When I was young I had all kinds of severe sinus problems. When I was a boy back in the 1940s all the way from age 9 my Dad had me in his auto repair shop washing greasy parts in gasoline, grinding, buffing and riveting the asbestos brake shoes on the bands, breathing exaust et al. Not only that but my parents had no knowledge of good diet regime. We ate the ice cream, white flower products, sugar donuts, nitrite laced lunch meats, spam, et al, et al. Anyhow it did a job on my youth years when my body was developing. I was not a healthy young person. While in the Air Force an old fellow in the church I attended who was healthy and fit got me interested in alternatives. Back then (1950s) the wholistic science was like a Model T Ford compared to today's Alexis so far as technology and advancement.My health began to slowly improve in spite of the tech just by improving diet but even with diet, the science has advanced wholistically to the point that having knowledge of good diet regime, our program gets continually more refined.Due to my bad start health wise in life I likely would be dead or infirmed decades ago if it weren't for the alternatives including herbs minerals, vitamins, lots of pure water, diet, exercise including gardening, et al.YOU CAN BEAT YOUR PROBLEMS. Likely you didn't get as bad an early start healthwise in life as me and likely your system is more able to be repaired by a good health regime.Here's some suggestions for beginning (I say "beginning) NOW to improve. Your God designed body has an amazing ability to repair, given the right stuff to make it happen:I see you're from NY state. If you're down state I understand there's a good alternative in Manhattan (Sinus Center of Manhattan) which uses a product called Sinol which you can take without side effects. We have it on hand as I still get some hay fever in the grass season. You can read about Sinol here: #1 Press Release Distribution Platform | PR Distribution.2. Avoid the following foods:
a. ALL milk and cheese products except possibly an organic plain white yougart.
b. Grain products in general, especially refined ones except perhaps some millet and brown rice.
c. Avoid ALL junk food including sweets. Sugar inflames pain and causes conjestion.
d. No clorinated or chemical treated water.
e. Read labels. No nitrite laced products like cold cuts, hot dogs, many beers, wine, et al.
f. No food after 6 PM
g. No coffee and other caffine products like pop et al. (read labels)
h. No deep fried or other fried food.
i. Nothing with hydrogenated oils.3. Don't stay up too late. Get your sleep.
& on't eat after 6 PM.4. Don't smoke. VERY BAD.5. Don't eat between meals and EAT LIGHT.6. Some things to consume:
a. Herbal teas such as pepermint, green tea, catnip, camomile, et al.
b. Brown rice, millet
c. organic WHITE UNSWEETENED yogart available at most larger food stores
d. lots of steamed or raw vegies & some fruits, all preferably organic and don't mix fruit's and vegies at same meal as a general rule.
e. Avacados are good
d. Fresh fish and sardines preferably packed in water.
e. COD LIVER OIL EXCELLENT, preferably a good product from the Northern seas having less mercury. We get this and other products from GARDEN OF LIFE. You can google it. They are a very reliable company for suppliments.I suggest you get some Sinol NOW and begin flushing out those nasal and head cavities. No perscription needed.I'm not telling you what to do, my friend. I'm just a beggar telling another begger where I found bread. Myself, I would wean off drugs and on to the alternatives. Stop enriching the fat cat pharms & meds and start getting better like I did. We raised two boys without docs. There's a place for them though and some of their methods are good. The real good docs are the integrated ones, real MDs, more and more of which are integrating into the alternatives. Dr Whitaker who has the largest alternative clinic in the US in CA is a good example.Don't look for or expect the proverbial silver bullet. Think wholistic and treat the body, not the symptom as most conventional docs are doing.Get on google and google up alternative sinus & headache stuff. There's a lot of it out there, but NOT ALL OF IT'S GOOD. You have to do your homework. It's a big science and lots to learn. Wifie & I are still learning and enjoying health with most of our original teeth at 70+ whereas we both started out unhealthy. Not only that, but the alternatives are good for those romantic highs we aged married heterosexuals still enjoy. Gotta run. God bless. Go with God and foods as he made them, keeping close to the natural state.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

If regimen I suggested is too tough, begin somewhere. Any one of the things should do some good but the more the better if you want relief. I know suffering, misery & pain. I've been there and the effort is worth it. Not only that but your body's cravings change to enjoy the good foods as you learn tasty ways to use them.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

I do know what's wrong with him, madear. He's sick. His body is sick and needs wholistically healed. He needs what will help his whole imune system, rid his body of the congestion and give it the stuff it needs to fix itself.How do I know it works? Because we raised two boys to be healthy adults by using the wholistic alternative regimes all their life and most of our own, all without the docs and zero pharmaceuticals. I also know it works because I have observed others who use it including a friend who had cripling arthritis eat her way into walking up a flight of stairs with no pain. et al, et al, et al.I know it works because I've checked out the science on it and remember how important almighty science is here? Dr Whitaker of the wellness clenic and Debora Ray who we listen to about 5 hours a week both cite clinical studies which verify their claims. .......Says the closed minded skeptic who's not been there and who knows not what she's talking about. I use it and it works with no bad side effects. Have you?

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

1. I don't always comply with what I've suggested for a suffering sick one in need of relief. My list is advice for RR to get what the $$$ fat & rich cats failed to do with their money driven agenda which is embedded in especially the USA. It's very often the terminal and desperate that finally try the alternatives and if they get sound advice it most always provides some benefit, sometimes being remarkable.2. If you're still young, now's the time to get apprised on the real nutritional science of your body, the most precious asset you have outside of your eternal soul. You'll be glad you did when you get my age.3. The fact that you don't resort to the pharms for common ailments is likely one of the main reasons you are relatively healthy.4. Sardines are great nutritionally and being small and containing less mercury than larger fish are safer. I do up all kinds of tasty nutritional ways of combining them into salads, spreads and such. Not only that but they're a wonderful cheap way of storing up survival food in case of catastrophy et al. They're ready packed in dinner size containers. I get mine at a discount food chain for 59c. They are packed in soybean oil which is'nt likely nutritionally as good as water but I suggested water packed ones for RR's conjestive ailment.I hope RR is well enough to log in and read and/or respond to what he thinks about all this. He said something about wishing at times he were dead. Hopefully that was off the cuff, considering all the hopeless responses he got from the $$$pharmaceutical$$$, alternative bashing apologists before reading some more hopful and positive info.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

1. All medical problems can be helped via alternative healthcare, wholistic diet regimes and exercise to some degree. Many chronic diseases have in fact been healed via alternative healthcare, wholistic diet regimes and exercise alone after the conventional MDs and drugs have failed.2. Western medicine has kept people living longer due to the technology in treating injuries, transplants, transfusions et al, but we're sicker with more cancer, heart ailments/attacks, obesity, mental illnesses, drug addiction, pharma side effects, diabetes, elderly facilities, hospitals, et al. These all keep us all alive including the elderly but a significant number of those living who would otherwise be dead are existing with a very poor quality of life.3. The wholistic alternative technology, knowledge and science has also significantly affected longevity in the last 50 years, much of which is never reported. Many (likely including myself) are alive because of this and this alone. Many who the MDs have labeled terminal have restorted to alternatives to live longer lives. So a number of factors effect our longevity.4. Diseases like cystic fibrosis, lupus, epilepsy, Huntington's, hemophelia, et al can all be helped to some degree by proper nutrition and wholistic healtcare, some to a significant degree.5. The nice thing is that rarely are there any bad side effects to the wholistic nutritional and alternative approach. Side effects are nearly always good for the body. Not so with the conventional pharmaceutical medical practices. 1. Personal experience is not meaningless, unless you question my truthfulness. There's quite a lot on google on Sinol. I suggest that you do your homework before making judgement on something you have had no personal experience with.2. I made no claims that alternatives always totally repairs as you seem to continuously imply. My position is that they can give the body what it needs to begin repairing to some degree without bad side effects and often for lasting cure, depending on many factors including advancement of the ailment, how willing the sick are to adhere to the regime, et al. Usually alternatives requires discipline in effecting change needed to make it effective.Finally as to your rant on Sinol, nearly all products, health care practitioners and business concerns related to health are in it to make a profit and propagate the business. Your rant about Sinol is meaningless yada until you can show evidence that it is quakery.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Hi Mobiogirl. Thanks for coming on. I had a response which I was reviewing and accidently hit the wrong key and lost it so I'll beginagain. Likely I'll not be able to address a lot now but will do what I can and hopefully get back to you. I'll cite two for now and there are others. More accurate wording by me in the quote of me above would have been healed or helped. These links should apply to two of the first two links your message called for regarding wholistic treatment of chronic diseases. The chronic diseases covered by these specific links may not be the same as on my short list but diseases which would be equally chronic and difficult to treat which would support the claim that the wholistic approach does not treat the symptom primarily but the whole body. Dr. Paul Goldberg himself has recovered from severe rheumatoid arthritis and colitis via wholistic and has treated professional athletes in the NFL and NBA.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Hi RR. I've been praying for you as you did not post for a spell and I was concerned that you may have taken a turn for the worse. I'm relieved to see that's not the case.The herbs you take are likely doing some significant good. It would be good for you to find and consult good professional advice from a reliable integrated MD or health practitioner as some herbals are more suitable than others for chronic conditions.Do you consume any foods containing white flour or white sugar? How about milk products like cheese and pasturized milk? Also do you live in or near a city where you have large supermarkets with organic sections? Some of the cities have a very good wholistic food chain called Wild Oats.The work conditions you work under appear to be very bad for sinus related problems. Filters and simple masks help a little but are very limited as to adequate protection. It might help to go outside & do a lot of deep breathing in good fresh air when you can take breaks. You can also take probiotics before you go to work and while working. You might want to check this out by google search. They're a relative new science in alternatives. Good ones are expensive to produce and consequently to buy.Your position on the alternatives appears to have advanced some from skeptical at the beginning of the thread to more positive at this point. Hopefully you will continue to improve as you delve deeper into the science of the alternatives which an ever growing number of MDs are integrating into their practice. God bless!

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Too bad you don't require as much research evidence to justify conventional practitioner's ($$$quack, quack, quack$$$) widespread prescriptions of medicines on which warnings on the containers include side effects all the way from nausia to heart attacks to death, thousands of deaths occuring yearly from the death symptoms alone.Perhaps it would be good for you to contact Dr Goldberg and challenge him for some of the research you are looking for. Who knows? Maybe he or someone on his staff will find the time to respond.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

What are the side effects of the ones you take or have taken according to the warnings? What percentage of patients do you think research each and every medication they take? 1. How many alternative clinics can you document who administer tap water via a needle?2. How many deaths have been confirmed to have been attributed to alternative practices and/or alternative suppliments such as herbs, vitamins, minerals, detoxification cleanses, fasting and wholesome diets, et al in the past year? Zero? One? Three or four? How many, madear? Good, but consider this: How do you research an entire wholistic regime which involves everything from minimal conventional methodology integration to diet, exercise, herbals, vitamins, sunlight, deep breathing, medical examinations, message, chiropractice, juicing, et al? Likely if you go into Dr Goldberg's clinic or Dr Whitaker's largest alternative facility in the US, Whitaker's Wellness Clinic in CA, you will get thoroughly examined, and treatment will be comprehensive including a number of regime practices including diet recommendations, suppliments et al.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Hi PD. I can't document what wifie and I do to keep our gums healthy and maintain a full mouth of most of the teeth we've had for about 70 years but I can tell you what works for us. We both had a bad start in life healthwise nutritionally speaking but over the years as the science of nutritional wholistic health advances we continue to fine tune our suppliment and diet program.My wife takes notes from Deborah Ray's excellent one hour Healthy Talk program weekdays which we get on the radio and via Dominion Network's Sky Angel satellite we get on a separate dish on the roof we get other health programs from which we glean info. We also have books. One thing we have come to learn is that this is a science that is not easily explained except to say if one decides to learn it there's a lot of info out there. The reason it's so complicated is that our bodies are so complex and wonderfully created.I know there's critics out there badmouthing Dr. Lorrain Day's approach but if one cares to follow here regime of simply eating a lot of raw organically grown fruits and vegies supplemented by nothing but juices extracted from these, the science of it all becomes very minimal so far as the need to know how to make it work. She says she uses no packaged health care products. It just works because that's the way God designed the food derived from the plants to work. One can delve into the science ofwhy it works, and may be able to make a more wise choice of which plant products work best for what. One can enhance their diet by leaning towards such a diet without being so strict. Dr. Day has a website which can be googled. You'll find pros and cons on the account of her own experience with cancer. I tend to think that perhaps some criticism of her was warranted but her critics throw out the baby with the bath water, not allowing her regime for any of the credit for her own healing.We eat a lot of raw but also some fish, chicken an occasionally other meats. We eat lots of avacadoes, seeds and nuts et al.We also use a number of food suppliments. I'm going to tell you which vitamins and minerals our research has found to be beneficial for gum disease as well as things which we avoid to keep our teeth and gums healthy. We are not in the wholistic healing business and have no vested interest in any company but we have found several companies which we have chosen because of the high standard they work on and we've been well satisfied with the quality of their products. One is Bio Active Nutrients (our main source of most of our vits and minerals). Another is Maximum Living. There's also Essential Formulas which markets Dr. O'Hhira's pro-biotics which is expensive. We get them cheaper from "i-herb" Garden of Life products are excellent also. They have an excellent green drink (a wonderful all in one health drink) which would be very good for gums and they have an Excellent top of the line cod liver oil which is high potency fish liver oil with no mercury, being derived from the northern seas. Dr. O'Hhira is from Japan.
1. A high quality vitamin/mineral complex having as much magnesium as calcium in it as well as the trace minerals like zinc and chromium. (to make you shine) Minerals needful for healthy teeth, gums and overall health and which are very deficient in the average American diet.
2. Extra Vita C containing the flavinoids).
3. Lots of high grade green tea (not before bedtime) We use Celestial Seasoning's teas, available in stores.
4. I see on the web that silica is good for gums but not alone. Alvita produces a horsetail grass tea having silica in it.
5. High grade fish liver oil excellent source of Vit D needul for gum health. The one I meantioned we use has pepermint in it which makes it more palatible.
6. COQ10 known for blood circulation via blood vessel health would likely be benefical to enhance circulation to the gums.
7. NO SUGAR product of any kind. We use xylitol or stevia which I call 'sinless sweetener.'
8. Avoid sticky foods that stick to the teeth & gums.Of course, we give all of the above credit for augmenting our wholistic approach to good health for the entire body. You treat the gums and the side effects are all good. You treat arthritis the natural way and the side effects are likely to be healther gums, heart & every system in the body enhanced. We use no whole wheat bread except that which is organic sprouted grain bread. Many so called breads have tricky labels which allow them to call it 'whole wheat' but if the first ingredient in the list is 'wheat flour' it's likely white flour darkened some by whole wheat and possibly coloring or molasses, et al. The wheat gluten seems to bother me but not in the sprouted organic that we use. I fully agree. Keep up the good work and if hubby isn't on the band wagon work to get him aboard and he should improve as well. Keep on keeping on figuring it out yourself. Even many of the alternative folks contradict one another so you have to sort it all out as to what makes science sense to you.We likely spend somewhere between a hundred fifty to two hundred a month on suppliments, but hey, most folks spend a lot more than that for an insurance program or ciggies, pop, ice cream, et al and if one has to pay for the pharms or doc visits, likely a whole lot more.Folks put the best stuff in the car engine & tranny et al. If they treated the engines (replaceable) as they treated the precious body (irreplaceable) with all of it's intricate functions, they'd be putting used deep fry oil in the crank case and think it would still run. Then they'd take it to a ripoff $$$garage who'd drain the deep fry oil along with the crank shaft filings , patch up the scored crank shaft with new bearing caps, hand them the huge $$$ bill and send them on their way. Back in the early 60s I bought a cool Studebaker Skyhawk beauty and headed out for Wyo to see my parents from upstate NY. Somewhere in Neb she began knocking. We made it to my dad's ranch where we took the Ford Jubilee tractor lift & hoisted her up. I dropped the pan and removed the bearing caps to find that I'd been ripped off big time by a big new car dealer in Buffalo. Imo, that a pretty analogous to what conventional medicine, and admittedly some of the less scrupulous and poorly informed alternative practitioners are doing, especially in the US, is doing only on a much larger scale.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

It appears that you are into a good wholistic regime of mostly good eating. I hope RR is finding this to be helpful.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Mobiogirl, I see nothing in 57 as significant begging a response. 104 is Annastasia's message. Abe: Perhaps you could cite something which you'd like for me to address. Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Hi LindaLou. A hearty welcome to EvC. I haven't been on line much lately as I've had so much away from the computer needing done. I just want to say that I've been reading your input and I very much appreciate the great and noble effort you've made to respond to all that's been put forth for you to address. Had I been aboard I would have lent some support to your position in these issues. I follow Deborah Ray and Dr. Julian Whitaker who has the largest alternative facility in the nation. He regularly cites the scientific papers on much of what he recommends and what he addresses in public. He and Deborah Ray also do a great job of exposing the harmful effects of many conventional drugs and practices. Today on his program Dr Whitaker actually recommended a pharm drug which had no ill side effects. He intigrates in his practice but about 90% is alternative whereas before he got into the alternatives 100% was conventional. He now is able to do soooo much more in actually curing patients of things which he once was unable to do when using the conventional methodology.We also follow a number of others many of whom have also been on Deborah Ray's program. You can get the programs on line by googling Deborah Ray radio.Please don't be intimidated by those who don't see it your way. Imo, you have as much right as they do in putting forth your arguments for what you believe and I believe you've done so in a proper manner, doing the research which I've not had the time do do.I believe you said you have some heart palpatation. I've had times in my life when this has been a problem with me, but at 72 I have it totally under control and have for decades via nutrition, minerals and vitamins etc. I haven't been to an MD for about 40 years and less than a dozen times in my life. We also raised 2 boys without MDs except for a couple of injuries and childbirth. There have been a few times when we've been to NDs but try to do our own research when in need. I can emphatically claim that alternatives and nutritional are the safe and sure way to go for optimum health and wellness from my own experience and from many others who I know about.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

Percy, the following exerpt from the website LindaLou cited appears to be quite impressive and mainstream. Could you agree to that?

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.

1. How do you know for sure that there are no others besides his own.2. Aside from the journals, how about the following mainstream activity? 3. Do you really expect the powerful entrinched conventional medical establishment to wrap loving arms around anyone who dares expose the atrocities and shortcomings of their $$ driven lucrative healthcare agenda? Edited by Buzsaw, : clarification

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.