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Author Topic:   Global Warming & the Flood
JonF
Member (Idle past 197 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 10 of 164 (226751)
07-27-2005 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by TheLiteralist
07-26-2005 4:46 AM


This would be a good exercise for you to work out yourself.
From approximately what height have you seen rain fall?
From approximately what height are you proposing the flood waters fell?
Approximately what volume of water have you seen fall as rain? (You might want to look at The wettest place).
Approximately what volume of water are you proposing fell as flood waters?
The energy released in falling is the volume of water times its density (1 gram per cubic centimeter) times the distance that it fell. How does this compare with the bomb that was dropped on Hiroshima?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by TheLiteralist, posted 07-26-2005 4:46 AM TheLiteralist has replied

Replies to this message:
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JonF
Member (Idle past 197 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 119 of 164 (230397)
08-06-2005 8:11 AM
Reply to: Message 118 by TheLiteralist
08-06-2005 2:55 AM


Re: I goofed - here are the real numbers.
Heat doesn't sink...not usually...so I would tend to think that the majority of the heat is no concern as it is above the troposphere (but I could be wrong about that, I guess).
Yup, you are wrong. The old "heat rises" bit refers to convection in relatively small volumes1 of gases and liquids in a gravitational field. When you consider the Earth and its atmosphere as a whole the only way that heat leaves that system is by radiation … and radiation is slow and inefficient. Essentially all heat generated within a hundred miles or so of the Earth's surface goes into heating up the Earth.
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1When you start talking about the whole atmosphere a big chunk of it rising in one place must be balanced by some other big chunk of it falling in some other place.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by TheLiteralist, posted 08-06-2005 2:55 AM TheLiteralist has replied

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JonF
Member (Idle past 197 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 120 of 164 (230398)
08-06-2005 8:20 AM
Reply to: Message 118 by TheLiteralist
08-06-2005 2:55 AM


Re: I goofed - here are the real numbers.
If I'm wrong about the heat above the troposphere being no concern, then shouldn't the heat be distributed throughout the entire volume of the atmosphere and flood waters per day?
The accumulation of heat would reasonably be distributed throughout the entire volume of the atmosphere and flood waters per day, but as Bill Murray says, "It just doesn't matter!!". At the end of the 40 days you get all that heat built up. Heat can be thought of as a quantity of stuff; it's not like temperature, which is a measurement of a quantity of stuff. You are adding a whole bunch of heat by your scenario, and subtracting a very little heat by radiation to space, and whether you add it over an hour or a day or 40 days or a year doesn't matter much. What people have been calculating is the total heat added, not the rate at which heat is added, and the total heat added doesn't depend on the time period over which it's added. Now, if you start calculating the radiation to space, you would typically calculate that as a rate of heat loss per day or whatever; a little more is going to be lost over 40 days than is lost over an hour. But people have done these calculations before … the result ain't good for your scenario.

This message is a reply to:
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