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Author Topic:   Where did the flood waters come from and where did they go?
edge
Member (Idle past 1737 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 28 of 160 (218538)
06-21-2005 10:49 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Tranquility Base
06-21-2005 7:52 PM


Re: Let's remember that 'where did the water come from/go' is a problem for both camps!
Mainstream science already agrees that the earth was almost completely flooded. The last little bit might require some haggle work on our part but I simply don't claim to be able to prove that at present.
The point is that we can get close enough wihtout any haggling. If you want to haggle about the last details feel free but for me it's sufficent that we already understand how *most* of the earth was flooded.
Umm, last time I checked, most of the earth is flooded right now. So, are we in the middle of a global flood? By your logic we are. The mainstream position has always been that there has never been a global flood in the bibical sense. If you have statments to the contrary, this would be a good time to present them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Tranquility Base, posted 06-21-2005 7:52 PM Tranquility Base has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1737 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 29 of 160 (218543)
06-21-2005 11:03 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Tranquility Base
06-21-2005 7:55 PM


Re: Just how much of the continents have ever been covered with water?
We explain it via runaway subduction as you know. We don't claim any of this is bullet-proof. It is suggestive and works together as a consistent, parsimonious framework.
Bullet proof? This idea is not giggle proof.
Are you holding out on us? Do you really have any evidence that CPG actually occurred other than the fact that you need it in order to fit the entire geological record into a teacup?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Tranquility Base, posted 06-21-2005 7:55 PM Tranquility Base has replied

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edge
Member (Idle past 1737 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 107 of 160 (219757)
06-26-2005 2:50 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by TrueCreation
06-26-2005 2:24 PM


Re: TB Tell me again when did Noah's Flood occur
Accelerated decay is not directly relevant to the CPT and runaway subduction (and baumgardner's computer models of the process), ...
So, you are saying that Baumgardner does not rely upon accelerated decay? What then is the mechanism for CPT? Why did it start, and why did it stop? I am assuming that you still adhere to CPT as you always did before. It appears that your education has not yet taken effect on your core belief system.
... and the rate of tectonic motion is not a physical law.
Correct. There is no law regarding the rate of tectonic motion. However, there is also no evidence that it was ever significantly different in the past.
You need to open another thread if you want to support your assertions. Of course I have dealt with your type many times before and the likelyhood of you actually doing so is slim to none, and yet you will go on making those same unsupported assertions. I would like to see you prove me wrong here. But as people say on the board, "put up or shut up".
Chris, if you are going to espouse fringe theories, you need to accept the fact that you will continually run into people 'of our type'. On the other hand, if you come back with a boatload of evidence and can present it coherrently, you will find a willing, if still reluctant, audience. You need to face it, Baumgardner may be a fabulous modeler, but he has no clue about the field realities of geology. Perhaps you will be the one who puts a dose of reality into Baumgardner's model. However, I see little to be optimistic about in that regard: Baumgardner's ultimate defense is 'because God said so!'
** How did we get enough water to cover Mt. Everest and where did the water go? Either answer that or concede the point. It is as simple as that.
Chris: If you have been reading the thread and understand what has been discussed, you would not be asking me this question.. this problem does not exist with CPT.
Correct, as far as you go. However, in order to have the rates of spreading that you are talking about, in such a short period of time, there should be abundant, diagnostic evidence in the geological record. In fact, I would guess that the amount of heat released and the toxic gases would render the earth quite sterile. The stratigraphy of such a deposit would not resemble what we see as normal epeiric seas or pelagic sedimentation. The system would be much more volcanic in composition and in structure. You see, Chris, you have to look at all of the evidence at one time to make a coherrent theory as to the presence or absence of a flood. Just saying that high tectonic rates could do it is not sufficient to make CPT viable.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by TrueCreation, posted 06-26-2005 2:24 PM TrueCreation has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 126 by TrueCreation, posted 06-27-2005 9:03 PM edge has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1737 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 125 of 160 (220228)
06-27-2005 9:03 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by Tranquility Base
06-26-2005 11:23 PM


Re: YEC water problem
See post above. It is a mainstream researcher (Hager) that acknowledged Baumgardner's 'leader in the field' tectonic simulation engine.
This is nonsense. A model is not reality and, in fact, Baumgardner's model has no resemblance to the real world. I'm not sure what you know about numerical models, but I assure you that with Baumgardner's program, I could get the tectonic plates to fly through the air, if you would like. Being able to write a simulation and knowing what to put into it are completely different things.
I also choke a bit on the statement that Terra is the most powerful geological tool availble to geoscientists. This is hyperbolic nonsense, also. There are many tools in geosciences and I seriously doubt that the author of the statement has surveyed many of them. To say that a simulation program has such eminence is over the top.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by Tranquility Base, posted 06-26-2005 11:23 PM Tranquility Base has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 129 by Tranquility Base, posted 06-27-2005 9:16 PM edge has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1737 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 160 of 160 (221328)
07-02-2005 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by TrueCreation
07-01-2005 2:32 AM


Re: TB Tell me again when did Noah's Flood occur
I am sure you are aware of the copious instances of rain drop impressions in sediments throughout the geologic record.
I'm sure that most of us are aware. The problem is: how do you get "copious" raindrop impressions during a global flood? Once again, it is getting difficult to see where you stand. Do you believe there was a global (biblical literalist) flood, or not? If not, why adhere to CPT?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by TrueCreation, posted 07-01-2005 2:32 AM TrueCreation has not replied

  
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