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Author Topic:   What does ID theory say?
Straggler
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 47 of 67 (488716)
11-15-2008 6:22 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Cold Foreign Object
11-14-2008 7:32 PM


Re: Design theory
Can you explain why it is that ID theory never results in any specific verifiable predictions or discoveries?
Or if you think it does can you prvide some examples of discoveries made as a direct consequence of ID theory?
If not then do you think that this demonstrates a weakness in ID theory?
Evolutionists would, I think, argue that prediction and discovery of new evidence is a key feature in demonstrating the veracity of evolutionary theory.
I am interested to know how you counter this seemingly argument clinching position?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-14-2008 7:32 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-15-2008 6:44 PM Straggler has replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 52 of 67 (488721)
11-15-2008 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by Cold Foreign Object
11-15-2008 6:32 PM


Re: Design theory
Special creation, also known as independent or separate creation, is a scientific hypothesis that claims to explain how species are introduced into reality.
Exactly.
An unverified and, arguably, unverifiable hypothesis.
At best.
As opposed to evolutionary theory which has passed numerous tests of verifiable prediction thus making it a verified and superior hypothesis. I.e a fully formed scientific theory.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-15-2008 6:32 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 53 of 67 (488722)
11-15-2008 6:50 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by Cold Foreign Object
11-15-2008 6:44 PM


Re: Design theory
Behe in Black Box (1996) showed biochemical systems irreducibly complex. Dembski in Intelligent Design (1999) argued that mutation cannot be random since specified complexity (and I add: adaptation) are universally accepted phenomena.
So what exactly are the specific verified predictions and discovery of new evidence in these examples?
Show me a sealed envelope containing an evolutionary prediction.
The predicted, searched for and discovered Tiktaalik transitional.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-15-2008 6:44 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 66 of 67 (489673)
11-29-2008 6:48 AM
Reply to: Message 56 by Cold Foreign Object
11-17-2008 5:50 PM


Re: Design theory
Here is what I believe:
What you believe is immaterial
Both Creationism and Evolutionism interpret and explain the same database of scientific evidence. There is not two sets of evidence. There is one, and two major explanations of this evidence.
Science is not the subjective interpretation of facts designed solely to support a predefined world view regardless of the actual truth of that world view.
Fortunately for us all there is more to it than that.
Interpretation is not enough to ensure reliability of conclusion. The key to scientific investigation and the resulting reliability of conclusions is the testing of theories or hypotheses. Testing by prediction and verification.
You can interpret to your hearts content and come up with all sorts of justification for pretty much any story. There is a reason why creationist interpretations make no predictions and result in no new discoveries. It is because they are untrue.
Relentless bleating by creationists that they have an equally valid but minority interpretation of the same evidence is ignorant at best and dishonest at worst.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 11-17-2008 5:50 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
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