EvC Forum: Wealth Distribution in the USA

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Topic: Wealth Distribution in the USA

ringo

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Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 31 of 531 (699393)
05-18-2013 1:20 PM

Reply to: Message 14 by Coyote
05-17-2013 7:52 PM

Coyote writes:

Forcibly taxing enough money from the "rich" to even everyone out would cause the "rich" to stop working as hard.

So you're saying Donald Trump works a million times harder than me?

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ringo

Member (Idle past 442 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 80 of 531 (699534)
05-21-2013 12:29 PM

Reply to: Message 75 by Coyote
05-21-2013 1:08 AM

Coyote writes:

You're right, the current system is not equitable for those who actually create wealth.

You didn't answer my question: Does Donald Trump work a million times harder than me? How is it unfair to him if he pays more taxes but still has more left than I could ever dream of?

Coyote writes:

The same is true of redistributed wealth--you didn't earn it so it has far less value than money you actually earned through your own efforts. It is nothing to be proud of.

Is a nation where people don't starve in the streets something to be proud of?

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	Message 75 by Coyote, posted 05-21-2013 1:08 AM		Coyote has not replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 442 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 139 of 531 (699623)
05-22-2013 12:07 PM

Reply to: Message 102 by Percy
05-21-2013 6:39 PM

Percy writes:

So you believe people should be paid according to their needs rather than the value of their work.

Yes.

And in civilized countries, that's pretty much what we do. The poor are subsidized in many ways: free healthcare, low-income housing, welfare.

Unfortunately, the rich are getting richer by moving their oppression to uncivilised countries. It's the new imperialism.

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	Message 102 by Percy, posted 05-21-2013 6:39 PM		Percy has replied

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	Message 143 by Percy, posted 05-22-2013 1:07 PM		ringo has replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 442 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 147 of 531 (699633)
05-22-2013 1:53 PM

Reply to: Message 143 by Percy
05-22-2013 1:07 PM

Percy writes:

Government must act as a guarantor of some minimum level of health, subsistence and safety, while somehow not encouraging folly.

So redistribution of wealth is definitely the way to go. The only question is where it should begin and end. Some people seem to think that treating people humanely should stop at the border.

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	Message 143 by Percy, posted 05-22-2013 1:07 PM		Percy has replied

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	Message 153 by Percy, posted 05-22-2013 3:36 PM		ringo has replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 442 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 177 of 531 (699694)
05-23-2013 12:20 PM

Reply to: Message 153 by Percy
05-22-2013 3:36 PM

Percy writes:

I guess, if you like, you can think of an insurance company as a redistributor of the wealth gathered through its premiums.

Or you can think of an insurance company as a casino. It's a net loss for almost everybody.

Percy writes:

Actual active redistribution of wealth will always be plagued by the problem that the wealthiest will always be most able to protect their wealth from taxation.

I'm not overly concerned about the wealthy protecting their wealth. I'm mostly interested in getting a minimum amount of wealth down to the lower echelons. Whether they work for it or "earn" it in some other way or even "deserve" it or not isn't even an issue with me.

I'm only interested in people not being poor. Just not being poor ought to be seen as a benefit to society.

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	Message 153 by Percy, posted 05-22-2013 3:36 PM		Percy has replied

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	Message 181 by Percy, posted 05-23-2013 2:20 PM		ringo has seen this message but not replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 442 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 516 of 531 (712740)
12-06-2013 12:10 PM

Reply to: Message 511 by 1.61803
12-05-2013 12:14 PM

1.61803 writes:

I always thought that if you pay your employees more they will in turn go out and spend more, invest more and increase the economy.

My father used to tell a story about Henry Ford (which may be apocryphal):

Driving in to the plant one day, Ford noticed that many of his employees were arriving on foot, on bicycles, by streetcar, etc. so he stopped and asked them why they didn't drive cars. They laughed and said, "We can't afford cars on what you pay us."

He immediately doubled their wages.

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	Message 511 by 1.61803, posted 12-05-2013 12:14 PM		1.61803 has not replied

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