What's the Fabric of space made out of?

I'm just starting to read my ( ah em, autographed) copy of "The Fabric of the Cosmos" by Brian Greene. He is a very clear speaker and writer but somehow I think just what "the fabric" is may still not be answered by the end.I can recommend reading it if you are really interested in the topic. So far he is covering a lot of the historical ideas.

Perhaps Buz, you could fill me in on what you think space is made of?While you're at it can you describe what matter is made of. You know the desk under your computer, you and the air you breath. Just exactly what is it made of?

Thanks for the space answer. Whatever it is or isn't made of it does have some particular properties.The matter answer doesn't seem to be finished. As we have delved down into it it seems to be made of a relatively simple set of basic building blocks. These are, at this level, described by the math in the same way space is and are just as real (or "unreal").If string theory is right then matter ends up being "made of" (not the right words but I'm not sure we have them) a few very simple entities. These are now, and may remain, described by the mathematics of their properties just as spacetime is.When that level is reached spacetime is made of "spacetimeonium" and matter is "strings". Though I wouldn't be surprised if it is all made of the same "stuff" whatever that would turn out to be.This "space" you describe that is not "made" of anything still has certain properties. They have been predicted from the math and then measured. The properties are such that this "nothing" can indeed streach and warp. This is measured.I'm guessing that at this point to say something is "made of" anything doesn't make sense anymore. We are outside of the usual understanding of the world we think we see and well outside the normal use of the English words.The world we see is not what the underlying reality is. It is less like it than a picture on film is a good representation of the chemicals that "really" make it up.

I recommend you listen to the first lecture Buz.At between 20 minutes and 26ish minutes he points out the the professors don't understand this stuff.He says "You'll have to accept it. ... That is the way it works...If you don't like it go somewhere else -- to another universe where the rules are simpler."Feynman is talking to you Buz. This, that you call nonsense, is the way the universe IS! You're the one who thinks God made it. Take your issues up with Him; it is all His idea.This message has been edited by NosyNed, 03-12-2005 01:39 AM

You pointed us at this post 63 (Message 63) and said that no one had answered it.I think it has been but maybe we shoud try again.Space isn't made of anything that we experience on a normal basis. It isn't electrons and quarks, it isn't forces. Spacetime just is, it has certain properties. If you ask what it is "made of" then the answer is that it is made of something that has those properties.It isn't material stuff like your desk and it isn't forces like a magnetic field. We don't have a word for it other than it is "spacetime".You haven't asked what you or your desk are made of but deep down inside they aren't made of anything any more "real" than spacetime is. It is All an illusion that we live in.I'm sorry I misunderstood about your "nonsense" comment. You are right; physics is ok with "nonsense" that is part of the point that Feynman is making in his lectures. All of what we think we live in is not what is really "there". What "really" underlies it all we don't understand in the way we would like to. It doesn't connect to our ordinary experiences so our words and our minds get muddled.However, we can describe the behaviour of this "nonsense" very well. So we understand something about it. Something useful. It is amazing that in the last century we have gotten this far. Will we get to a better understanding in the next century. Feynman answers that at the end of the first hour with some like "I got a past Nobel prize not one for the future. I don't know"All others:I highly, highly recommend listening to these lectures Feynman was a master. I was lucky enough to attend a live lecture once.

It is "nonsense" in that it doesn't follow common sense. It isn't "understandable" in that we don't have the underlying reasons for it. The analogy with the Mayan (I think it was) priests applies. It is nice that you want the universe to conform to your ideas of "sensible". Feynman recognizes that his audience wants that too. Most of us do; many physicists have struggled with it just as you do.The problem you have, Buz, is the universe is as described. It does not behave in what you think of as a "sensible" way. It doesn't care (so I guess your God doesn't either) what you think is the right way for it to work. The facts of it's properites and behaviour are as given.You don't like it? Take Feynmans advice and move to another universe this one is apparently not to your liking.

I took my daughter thourgh it for Physics 11 last year. I can help via email if you want. It would be good to refresh me yet again.

I believe this is incorrect. From reading Greene's "The Fabric of the Cosmos" I understand that the changes due to relative motion are the equivalent to the rotation of spacetime. Different directions produce a rotation in different directions.Thus if something (one) is moving away from the observer it's space-time is shifted one way and if moving toward it is shifted the other way. This procuces different ideas of which is future and past between the two.I could quote material from the book if you want. It is a interesting read.

Yes, sorry for nitpicking and complicating things.