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Author Topic:   Candy and games and responsibility.
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 16 of 94 (145154)
09-27-2004 7:04 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by CK
09-27-2004 7:02 PM


quote:
Now, can you really tell the difference between Border's and Barnes and Noble's? I can't.
Neither could I - but do I give a crap? nope - just pile em high and sell em low.
quote:
And do the people behind the counter at Starbucks seem happy to be there and do they give a crap about coffee? Nope.
Who cares? They can go home and kill themselves as far as I am concerned - just give me the hot coffee and be f**king quick about it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by CK, posted 09-27-2004 7:02 PM CK has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 12:25 PM CK has replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2198 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 17 of 94 (145347)
09-28-2004 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by CK
09-27-2004 7:04 PM


Now, can you really tell the difference between Border's and Barnes and Noble's? I can't.
quote:
Neither could I - but do I give a crap? nope - just pile em high and sell em low.
But what if you wanted to find a particular edition of a book, or wanted to know the best book of a certain author, but none of the people who worked at the bookstore knows anything about books?
What if you were trying to decide between several books on the same subject, but there was nobody in the bookstore who knew the differences between them and why you might choose one over the other?
This isn't a fantasy that I just made up or something. You used to be able to find very knowledgeable people like that in the original Border's bookstore, before they franchised and became bland, impersonal, and the quality of service nosedived. The same is true of Starbucks and a bunch of other companies.
And do the people behind the counter at Starbucks seem happy to be there and do they give a crap about coffee? Nope.
quote:
Who cares? They can go home and kill themselves as far as I am concerned - just give me the hot coffee and be f**king quick about it.
Why should they care if your coffee is hot just because you want it that way?
Why should they move any faster than they feel like moving just becasue you want them to be quick?
What if you wanted to buy some coffee for someone who really likes it and you wanted to know the difference in flavor between their Sumatran and Guatemalan, but nobody there knows, or makes something up and lies to you?
It seems like you feel a sense of entitlement to certain service expetations but also feel as though you shouldn't pay for them.
Besides, if all of the Starbucks employees go home and kill themselves every day, your coffee is almost certainly going to be cooler and get to you slower, and will probably taste a lot worse, because the turnover rate at the shop will be so high that the speed and consistency developed over time, through practice and repetition, will never be developed. High turnover rates also raises costs for companies, which are passed on to you, the consumer.
So, that is another reason it is in your best interests for workers to be treated well; less turnover makes prices lower in the long run as well as enabling workers to become skilled at their jobs, thus making better coffee quicker and becoming more accurate and quicker on the cash register, thus giving you better service and products for less money.
If you want to pay for a McCulture, you will get a McCulture.
If you want to live in a world where you get friendly, knowlegeable service, and if you want to live in a world where people are treated at work as if they are human beings, then you will pay a little more, but that is the world you will live in.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by CK, posted 09-27-2004 7:04 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 1:53 PM nator has replied
 Message 20 by Dan Carroll, posted 09-28-2004 4:02 PM nator has not replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 18 of 94 (145379)
09-28-2004 1:53 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by nator
09-28-2004 12:25 PM


quote:
But what if you wanted to find a particular edition of a book, or wanted to know the best book of a certain author, but none of the people who worked at the bookstore knows anything about books?
why would this be the case? you seem to think it's a straight trade-off between personal=good, impersonal=bad. I spend my days in large,complex,messy organizations - that's a simplistic analysis at best.
quote:
What if you were trying to decide between several books on the same subject, but there was nobody in the bookstore who knew the differences between them and why you might choose one over the other?
I never require that type of assistance and if I need that information I'll get it off the net (which frankly is where I buy books anyway)
quote:
This isn't a fantasy that I just made up or something. You used to be able to find very knowledgeable people like that in the original Border's bookstore, before they franchised and became bland, impersonal, and the quality of service nosedived. The same is true of Starbucks and a bunch of other companies.
I don't care - I don't require that type of assistance - I just want low,low prices.
quote:
Why should they care if your coffee is hot just because you want it that way?
Because I'll throw it back over the counter and get their ass shitcanned.
quote:
What if you wanted to buy some coffee for someone who really likes it and you wanted to know the difference in flavor between their Sumatran and Guatemalan, but nobody there knows, or makes something up and lies to you?
How would you know the difference? - again I couldn't give a toss what it is as long as it's a)cheap and b) tastes nice. I don't go into starbucks for a conversation - I go in for a quick coffee. If people want that - go to somewhere that looks for competitive advantage via Differentiation Focus (ie providing that extra level of service). Starbucks doesn't do that and people like me are quite happy with that set-up.
quote:
It seems like you feel a sense of entitlement to certain service expetations but also feel as though you shouldn't pay for them.
My only expection of service in such places is that they take my order and hand over the goods.
quote:
If you want to pay for a McCulture, you will get a McCulture.
Sounds good to me - just what I want.
quote:
If you want to live in a world where you get friendly, knowlegeable service, and if you want to live in a world where people are treated at work as if they are human beings, then you will pay a little more, but that is the world you will live in.
Just as a FYI - you don't need to outline the benefits in slow hand for me - I have degree, Master's and teacher's qualifications in economics (plus considerate experience as a business consultant).
This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 09-28-2004 12:57 PM
This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 09-28-2004 01:41 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 12:25 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 3:51 PM CK has replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2198 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 19 of 94 (145405)
09-28-2004 3:51 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by CK
09-28-2004 1:53 PM


But what if you wanted to find a particular edition of a book, or wanted to know the best book of a certain author, but none of the people who worked at the bookstore knows anything about books?
quote:
why would this be the case? you seem to think it's a straight trade-off between personal=good, impersonal=bad. I spend my days in large,complex,messy organizations - that's a simplistic analysis at best.
I don't think that impersonal companies are bad and personal companies are good, as a rule. I shop at both kinds, but I realize that I am making a choice, and that my choice has an impact on what kind of business will survive and what kind will not.
What is bad is that the impersonal companies do not offer the kind of service that a lot of people want. Lack of good service is a leading complaint among consumers, particularly in retail shops.
If it wasn't a selling point, why would so many companies advertise how great their service is?
After Sept. 11th, people in our town didn't head to McDonald's or Starbucks to be together, they headed to my company, because they have an emotional attachment to it, because they feel comforted here.
Why would anyone want a homogenized, bland, cheap world in which every town has the same crappy chain restaurants and retail shops? What would be the point of traveling to Rome if it was covered with Blimpy Burger shops and Gap stores?
According to you, it's cheap, so it's good.
What if you were trying to decide between several books on the same subject, but there was nobody in the bookstore who knew the differences between them and why you might choose one over the other?
quote:
I never require that type of assistance
Is that because you are already an expert of the subject, or perhaps because you have the time to sit down and read all of the books before you buy it so you make the right choice?
The point is, you may not think you require that assistance but once you are able to go to a place where you will get great recommendations, you will appreciate it a great deal.
I have found that to be the case with my customers.
In fact, we have even has (very balsy) customers call us on their cell phones from other retail shops for help choosing a product category we also sell because there was nobody there at that shop that knew anything.
quote:
and if I need that information I'll get it off the net (which frankly is where I buy books anyway)
I buy books off the net, too, but it's not the same as standing in front of someone while they point out the various attributes of a product.
This isn't a fantasy that I just made up or something. You used to be able to find very knowledgeable people like that in the original Border's bookstore, before they franchised and became bland, impersonal, and the quality of service nosedived. The same is true of Starbucks and a bunch of other companies.
quote:
I don't care - I don't require that type of assistance - I just want low,low prices.
Then you will get a low, low quality product and/or experience.
Perhaps the quality of the human interaction in a retail shop is unimportant to you, but it is very important to me.
Maybe you want crap coffee, but I don't.
Why should they care if your coffee is hot just because you want it that way?
quote:
Because I'll throw it back over the counter and get their ass shitcanned.
Oh, so your're an asshole customer who isn't able to put yourself in anyone else's shoes.
You are also missing my point.
If you had a shitty-paying job and were treated like shit by the management and treated like shit by the customers, what motivation are you going to have to do anything particularly well?
What if you wanted to buy some coffee for someone who really likes it and you wanted to know the difference in flavor between their Sumatran and Guatemalan, but nobody there knows, or makes something up and lies to you?
quote:
How would you know the difference?
The person you are buying it for might easilyu know the difference.
I could tell the difference.
quote:
again I couldn't give a toss what it is as long as it's a)cheap and b) tastes nice. I don't go into starbucks for a conversation - I go in for a quick coffee. If people want that - go to somewhere that looks for competitive advantage via Differentiation Focus (ie providing that extra level of service). Starbucks doesn't do that and people like me are quite happy with that set-up.
I know what differentiation is.
My point is that Starbucks didn't used to be like that.
My point also is that the more you support a place like Starbucks, and the more you complain about the prices of places that do differentiate themselves by offering superior service and quality (providing real jobs and better wages), the less those better service places will be able to survive.
Then, all you will have is mediocre-to-bad everything, with no high-quality anything.
It seems like you feel a sense of entitlement to certain service expetations but also feel as though you shouldn't pay for them.
quote:
My only expection of service in such places is that they take my order and hand over the goods.
No, you want the goods to be hot, and to taste good, and to be consistent, and to be open when you want them to be, and for people to run the registers properly and charge you correctly, etc.
If you want to pay for a McCulture, you will get a McCulture.
quote:
Sounds good to me - just what I want.
I think you are just being belligerant.
Are you seriously telling me that you would relish a world in which there were no nice restaurants, or full-service salons, or any kind of professional service providers at all?
If you want to live in a world where you get friendly, knowlegeable service, and if you want to live in a world where people are treated at work as if they are human beings, then you will pay a little more, but that is the world you will live in.
quote:
Just as a FYI - you don't need to outline the benefits in slow hand for me - I have degree, Master's and teacher's qualifications in economics (plus considerate experience as a business consultant).
...and I have 10 years on the floor in high-quality retail service establishments, the last 6 in a company nationally recognized, consulted, and emulated for it's service.
In fact, I've done a little service consulting for my company myself.
This message has been edited by schrafinator, 09-28-2004 02:53 PM
This message has been edited by schrafinator, 09-28-2004 02:57 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 1:53 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 4:21 PM nator has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 94 (145406)
09-28-2004 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by nator
09-28-2004 12:25 PM


What if you wanted to buy some coffee for someone who really likes it and you wanted to know the difference in flavor between their Sumatran and Guatemalan, but nobody there knows, or makes something up and lies to you?
You know, I used to work at a Starbucks, and this was part of our training. You don't move out of trainee until you can recite that shit in your sleep.
So, that is another reason it is in your best interests for workers to be treated well
I can't believe I'm sitting here defending Starbucks, but they actually treat their employees incredibly well. For instance, they're the only service-industry chain in the country that gives health care to part-time workers. (Or at least they used to be, I don't know if someone else does now too.)

"If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars."
-George Meyer, Simpsons writer

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 12:25 PM nator has not replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 21 of 94 (145411)
09-28-2004 4:21 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by nator
09-28-2004 3:51 PM


quote:
What is bad is that the impersonal companies do not offer the kind of service that a lot of people want. Lack of good service is a leading complaint among consumers, particularly in retail shops.
Well they should do what the informed consumer does - go elsewhere. If enough people want personal service, the market will support if it.
quote:
Why would anyone want a homogenized, bland, cheap world in which every town has the same crappy chain restaurants and retail shops? What would be the point of traveling to Rome if it was covered with Blimpy Burger shops and Gap stores?
According to you, it's cheap, so it's good.
You totally miss my point - that's what I want as an informed consumer , what YOU want (as a consumer is none of my business). I don't claim that I want all the world to be covered in such things but for general transactions - yes it want I require.
quote:
The point is, you may not think you require that assistance but once you are able to go to a place where you will get great recommendations, you will appreciate it a great deal.
No - I know I don't want assistance.
quote:
Perhaps the quality of the human interaction in a retail shop is unimportant to you, but it is very important to me.
Maybe you want crap coffee, but I don't.
Good for you - I want it cheap and hot, so do lots of other people. As long as it provides enough benefit to me - that's good enough.
quote:
In fact, we have even has (very balsy) customers call us on their cell phones from other retail shops for help choosing a product category we also sell because there was nobody there at that shop that knew anything.
Naw - It would be better to do it the other way - go to the "expert", get the advice and then go to the box-shifter for the lower price.
quote:
Oh, so your're an asshole customer who isn't able to put yourself in anyone else's shoes.
Tough crap - you operate in a consumer economy you make the best of it or work towards world socialism.
quote:
You are also missing my point.
Not at all - I just don't agree with it IN MY CASE (And as an informed consumer - that's all I need to worry about).
quote:
If you had a shitty-paying job and were treated like shit by the management and treated like shit by the customers, what motivation are you going to have to do anything particularly well?
not a lot - but then I don't care - I just want you to ring that coffee up and swipe that book along the till.
quote:
My point also is that the more you support a place like Starbucks, and the more you complain about the prices of places that do differentiate themselves by offering superior service and quality (providing real jobs and better wages), the less those better service places will be able to survive.
But as I have said, I don't want the better service - if you do - YOU pay for it.
quote:
Then, all you will have is mediocre-to-bad everything, with no high-quality anything.
wrong - if there is a demand for it - the market will support it, if not it will not.
This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 09-28-2004 03:54 PM
This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 09-28-2004 03:55 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 3:51 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 5:04 PM CK has replied
 Message 28 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 6:54 PM CK has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1496 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 22 of 94 (145417)
09-28-2004 5:04 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by CK
09-28-2004 4:21 PM


wrong - if there is a demand for it - the market will support it, if not it will not.
Who's this "market" you keep talking about? And what makes you think they have a choice?
I hate to shop at WalMart, and I try not to, but sometimes I don't have a choice - because my WalMart-scale wage doesn't go far enough to give me a choice.
Maybe I too would like to shop where the folks have a damn clue, and give a damn because they're paid a decent wage, but because I don't get paid a decnt wage, I have to shop at the cheap-ass places.
With WalMart the single largest contributer to the nation's GDP, it's ludicrous to suggest that the labor force and the market are somehow separate groups, or that the market is going to "buoy" higher wages. You can't pull yourself up by your own bootstraps.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 4:21 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 5:33 PM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 24 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 5:33 PM crashfrog has replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 23 of 94 (145424)
09-28-2004 5:33 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by crashfrog
09-28-2004 5:04 PM


quote:
With WalMart the single largest contributer to the nation's GDP, it's ludicrous to suggest that the labor force and the market are somehow separate groups, or that the market is going to "buoy" higher wages. You can't pull yourself up by your own bootstraps.
So everyone in the marketplace is on "walmart" style-wages? Yes the labour market and the market are connected BUT the labour force is not one big lump - those who can afford better service, get it - that's the way it's always been and always will be. That's why highly specialized shops are a niche (well partly to do with interest as well) - only a restricted segement can afford to shop there.
People talk about "real" wages - well that the amount that the market will pay - no more,no less - less seems to be the end result of world-wide labour marketplaces.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 5:04 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 24 of 94 (145425)
09-28-2004 5:33 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by crashfrog
09-28-2004 5:04 PM


quote:
With WalMart the single largest contributer to the nation's GDP, it's ludicrous to suggest that the labor force and the market are somehow separate groups, or that the market is going to "buoy" higher wages. You can't pull yourself up by your own bootstraps.
So everyone in the marketplace is on "walmart" style-wages? Yes the labour market and the market are connected BUT the labour force is not one big lump - those who can afford better service, get it - that's the way it's always been and always will be. That's why highly specialized shops are a niche (well partly to do with interest as well) - only a restricted segement can afford to shop there.
People talk about "real" wages - well that the amount that the market will pay - no more,no less - less seems to be the end result of world-wide labour marketplaces.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 5:04 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 5:47 PM CK has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1496 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 25 of 94 (145433)
09-28-2004 5:47 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by CK
09-28-2004 5:33 PM


So everyone in the marketplace is on "walmart" style-wages?
Well, that's the largest-growing economic sector, yes. You know all those "new jobs" Bush keeps touting? They're Walmart-scale jobs.
People talk about "real" wages - well that the amount that the market will pay - no more,no less - less seems to be the end result of world-wide labour marketplaces.
Less here, yes. The good thing about globalization is that eventually, we'll all get paid the same. But that's at the end. Right now, it really, really sucks to be us.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 5:33 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 6:43 PM crashfrog has replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 26 of 94 (145456)
09-28-2004 6:43 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by crashfrog
09-28-2004 5:47 PM


quote:
Well, that's the largest-growing economic sector, yes. You know all those "new jobs" Bush keeps touting? They're Walmart-scale jobs.
The same thing is happening in europe.
quote:
Less here, yes. The good thing about globalization is that eventually, we'll all get paid the same. But that's at the end. Right now, it really, really sucks to be us.
yep - we all get paid less :-(

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 5:47 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 6:47 PM CK has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1496 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 27 of 94 (145458)
09-28-2004 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by CK
09-28-2004 6:43 PM


The same thing is happening in europe.
And you don't think that has anything to do with the incredible expansion of these discount chains?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 6:43 PM CK has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2198 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 28 of 94 (145462)
09-28-2004 6:54 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by CK
09-28-2004 4:21 PM


First you say the following in reply to my statement:
In fact, we have even has (very balsy) customers call us on their cell phones from other retail shops for help choosing a product category we also sell because there was nobody there at that shop that knew anything.
quote:
Naw - It would be better to do it the other way - go to the "expert", get the advice and then go to the box-shifter for the lower price.
But then you say in reply to this statement:
My point also is that the more you support a place like Starbucks, and the more you complain about the prices of places that do differentiate themselves by offering superior service and quality (providing real jobs and better wages), the less those better service places will be able to survive.
quote:
But as I have said, I don't want the better service - if you do - YOU pay for it.
Don't you get it?
If you go to the expert at one store, but then buy from another store that doesn't offer expert service, then pretty soon there will be no store with expert service because you didn't support it.
As I said in my last message:
Then, all you will have is mediocre-to-bad everything, with no high-quality anything.
wrong - if there is a demand for it - the market will support it, if not it will not.
But, obviously there is a demand for "expert" service, if people do what you have obviously done; taken advantage of the training and expertise provided by one retailer, but not paying for it, and then rewarding another retailer with your money, even though the second retailer did not provide you with the service. In essence, you stole from the first company.
If everybody or most people did that; took the advice from the expert but bought elsewhere, how long will that first business stay afloat?
Because I get paid a good wage, I don't shop at Wal Mart.
Did you know that California is taking Wal Mart to court because the company pays such low wages that their workers have to go on Welfare and get food stamps? This amounts to a public subsidy of a private corporation.
So, we actually do pay more for those goods that we buy cheaply, the costs are just hidden in higher taxes for public assistance.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 4:21 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 7:50 PM nator has replied

  
CK
Member (Idle past 4156 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 29 of 94 (145483)
09-28-2004 7:50 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by nator
09-28-2004 6:54 PM


quote:
If you go to the expert at one store, but then buy from another store that doesn't offer expert service, then pretty soon there will be no store with expert service because you didn't support it.
Naw - low barriers to entry to the market place, someone will move into the niche, you exploit them and then wait for the next one to arrive.
quote:
But, obviously there is a demand for "expert" service, if people do what you have obviously done; taken advantage of the training and expertise provided by one retailer, but not paying for it, and then rewarding another retailer with your money, even though the second retailer did not provide you with the service. In essence, you stole from the first company.
what a load of rubbish - on that basic any conversation with an expert would be contractual in nature.
quote:
Did you know that California is taking Wal Mart to court because the company pays such low wages that their workers have to go on Welfare and get food stamps? This amounts to a public subsidy of a private corporation.
So, we actually do pay more for those goods that we buy cheaply, the costs are just hidden in higher taxes for public assistance.
That's nether here or there - what if Walmart charged 100% more for its products?, it does not automatically follow that the wages would be higher.
The up-market clothes shops do not pay significantly more to the shopgirl than the chain-store.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by nator, posted 09-28-2004 6:54 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by crashfrog, posted 09-28-2004 8:01 PM CK has replied
 Message 45 by nator, posted 09-29-2004 8:45 AM CK has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1496 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 30 of 94 (145484)
09-28-2004 8:01 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by CK
09-28-2004 7:50 PM


Naw - low barriers to entry to the market place
What, barriers like having to have a place to have a store? Needing inventory to sell? Having to compete with other people in the same line of work?
There's a limit to how low the "barriers" can get, especially since the largest barriers are anti-competitive ones erected by other businesses.
on that basic any conversation with an expert would be contractual in nature.
For decent people, Charles, it is. You're supposed reward good service with your dollar.
I deal with people like you, though, every day. Universally shitty tippers because they don't think that they should have to pay for good service.
That's nether here or there - what if Walmart charged 100% more for its products?, it does not automatically follow that the wages would be higher.
Ah, but if they charged 50% less, it does follow that they would have to pay lower wages; labor costs are their largest and most negotiable business expense.
The up-market clothes shops do not pay significantly more to the shopgirl than the chain-store.
Are you sure about that? It sure looks to me that the girls in the GAP are dressed a hell of a lot better, and more expensively, than the girls checking me out in Walmart. Of course, if you have the stats for that, I guess I'd like to see them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 7:50 PM CK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by CK, posted 09-28-2004 8:15 PM crashfrog has replied

  
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