SIN

This is my first post. I just I thought I would say a few things not all of which are scientific but are relevant. I believe that God made this world and us for His joy (as stated in the Bible). He gave a us a free will so that we might be able to serve Him uniquely. We abused this privilage and ended up with sin and degeneration. In order to believe the Bible you must act using faith. In this sort of situation you understand after you believe what you're trying to understand. I believed in Jesus, and after I did that the Bible and why the world is the way it is came clear to me. If I came to the Almighty God through the Bible, then that must be the only book because God only allows one way. I know this is circular reasoning according to scientific reasoning but once you believe in God then it all becomes a strait logical path. If you analyze the Bible as a pagan religeon then you come up with a bunch of self-destroying hypothesis. In order to understand the Bible you must put your faith in it. The way of redemption becomes clear then. Faith is far more exact and commiting than a certain amount of good works. God is not a relative God, as seen in the structure of the universe, so why should he have redemption something so relative as good works. The only way that someone could be %100 redeemed is if they asked someone who can make then %100 redeemed to do it.
God wants us to believe something that is hard to believe according to what theories of reasoning men have come up with. Therefore believeing something that isnt scientifically proven shows true faith. God wants our faith.
Also if you dont believe in God I would like to ask why. If you answer:God wouldn't let bad things happen, then how do you know Him well enough to say that statement if He doesnt exsist.
I understand that this wasnt a very clear presentation of the message I was trying to display so feel free to ask what I mean.

God does not expect us to know everything. I believe He made the universe so large and complex so we couldn't understand it. He made this world with infinite potential, even the potential for us to transgress.
There are some things He does want us to know. He wants us to know that He is God. For every person he reveals Himself in a different way. To a depressive person He might present Himself as a hope. To a literalist He might not have to do as much but rather let His creation do it. If you look deep enough into science and philosofy he will realize a Creator must have made it all. Where could matter come from?
Everyone has the urge for knowlegde, understanding, and peace. I believe God gave us these so we could find Him. The Bible says He manifests himself in His creation. Just look at all the perfect systems that we don't understand. They still work even after we transgressed and God cursed the land. I plead with you to think of origin, if you believe that a Being made it then God has manifested Himself to you. If you believe that you have a will for a reason then God has manifested Himself to you. If you don't believe you have a reason in life then what are you looking for when you live. I can't see how you're satisfied by thinking you've found the answer in a world that has no origin, designated systems, or absolutes.
I am done searching for the answers to life. I searched deeply into all I knew about the world and realized that Someone was showing Himself to me through what He made. i believe everyone can search and understand and I encourage you to try to think of deeper meanings to the things of this world.

Ok this one is a response to Message 12.Yea I guess I didn't explain my reasoning too good. I'll give an anology that might help. You look through a window and you see a man with hair. He's holding a sign that says, "If you walk into this room and you're bald you will grow hair." You could assume that it works because the man has hair. Out of faith you walk into the room and you grow hair. Now that your hair is there you have every reason to believe that walking into the room makes your hair grow. Just to make sure, you try it the next year and any lost hair grows back. Before your hair had grown back you had no sure reason to believe that it would grow back, but now that you've taken a step of faith you have more reasons.It all depends on how you define "god". If god,to you, is a supernatural being that can control things that we cannot, or if its a being that we can worship and depend on then there is no evidence. I believe that "god" is a term for a supernatural creator whom we depend on. Even if you dont believe a "god" is a creator then there must be another name for someone who made the universe. I believe there is only one God because in order for something so vast and advanced to be created then there must be perfect unity. Jehovah (God of Christianity) is a God with three distinct parts acting in such perfect unity that they are one. I dont believe in polytheistic religeons because I believe that "god" means creator and that this universe could not have been created under many gods who all probably would have wanted to be the most powerful. I don't believe in other monotheistic religeons because Jehovah answers all my questions and the way the world is backs up what He says. I have studied other religeons and unanswerable questions come up.I believe that God made this world with inumerable possibilities of how it could turn out. He made this world for His joy, therefore He made it with the allowance of confusion. The Bible discribes how Lucifer became jealous of God and rebelled. God cursed him and sent him to earth. On earth Lucifer (Satan) used deception and made man sin. Because man knew better, God cursed the land and cut off His fellowship with man. Satan continued to decieve and destroy but God did not allow him to touch our souls. Being the merciful God that He is, He allowed for redemption and offered fellowship if man admitted his reliance on God.God allows bad things to happen so that we can be drawn to Him. If He made life easy still after man sinned we would never admit our reliance on Him. The reason God doesn't simply make us good again is because He made rules when He made the earth and that would be breaking the rules. God offers a simply plan to come back into fellowship with Him. We are still on this earth because God wants to know if we're loyal to Him or Lucifer. Since I believe in God I have come to know who He is and why He does the things He does. Also as I realize my reliance on Him I want to serve Him more. What do you serve?

This is in response to message 14You said "I still have evidence that matter exists." I agree with you completely but, that matter had to have come from somewhere even if it did expand.Yes many people do search for God and religeon but don't fin it. I don't know why they dont because I don't know their motives. Maybe they don't know what they're looking for?Excuse me for saying perfect, they aren't, but if it weren't for degeneration and immorality then the systems would be perfect I believe. The cause of degeneration is explained in Genesis. I believe that if you analyze the systems but take out degeneration and immoral behavior then I believe they would be perfect.I believe that if I lied to myself to be happy it would turn up eventually. That's partly why I started to get involved in these debates because it could be revealed to me that I've misinterpretted something. So far this hasn't happened but since I'm carnal I could easily twist the words of the Bible into something different then it really means so that it would please my flesh. Although I am adamant on the fact that there's one God, the Bible is true if I interpret it the way it's supposed to, that Jesus is my Lord, and that I believe in Him. God says I will never understand everything so I am open to things that don't directly contradict God.

I just have a little to add for message 15I invite you to study the Theism of Christianity. Put it to the test. Theism is the only way to explain origin, behavior, our desires, why we're always searching for peace, why we have discernment, love, and why we feel better when we do nice things to people. I personally couldn't live if I thought I were simply material. Don't you feel at all you have more than yourself to serve or that there is more to you than this body? I don't have the remedy for sorrow though: God does.

In response to the last statement of message 19:Generally when you serve you serve something that could use your service. I have no scientific challenge towards your doctrine of service but I have experienced myself that by serving God He provides for me. I still have to do things, He doesnt pamper me, but when there is a need, I pray for it, and if God thinks I should have it He provides. Again I'm saying this from experience not scientific record. There's nothing wrong with helping people, I think its right, but I would rather give my full service to something that can always provide for me even if I can't prove it does. If you don't think God can always provide then read the biography of a missionary.

This is a response to message 20 and 21.20-Even if matter can form from energy or a "big bang" those need origins also. As you go farther down the line of origins, the only answer could be intervention from another realm. Since God is not matter then He could have always been. So far the only realm we know of that needs an origin/creator is the physical realm. The only explanation, that I can think of, for creation is intervention from something that was not bound by our laws and was in a different realm that we can't comprehend.21- Ok, so you believe that there’s only a physical part of you. Therefore, if you believe that, then the best thing to do with life is to be a hedonist. Assuming that you're an evolutionist because you don't believe in God, then I would like to ask how this promotes evolution. If organisms are constantly becoming more advanced and successful, and the most successful organisms, for what they have, are the ones that work in unity, wouldn't you think that humans should be progressing to unity if we're the most sophisticated? By serving yourself and pleasing yourself you degrade society, you have nothing to contribute, you go against the laws of your own belief (if you believe evolution) by digressing. The greatest progress is made by those you don’t waste their time living for pleasure. I wouldn't say you only live for yourself though because by participating in this we make progress.

Response to 22Here's an example of what it might be like without sin. In order for it to make since you have to believe other things but it at least gives a slight example. In the Bible it talks about a canopy of water over the earth. There was radiation and degeneration at the time but things were better than they are now. If there were a canopy of water over the earth then radiation would be blocked much better. Air pressure would be greater so dinosaur's circulatory systems would operate better. it wouldn't rain so there wasn't as much erosion and the dew from such a moist atmosphere would provide water. I don’t believe this story was made up by man to promote a perfect world before degeneration because people didn't know what help a canopy would be back then (probably). Remember, this wasn't a perfect world right before the canopy fell, which I believe happened in a flood, but it was better. So if you take more instances like this then going backwards you end up in a perfect world. The only other instance I can think of is God cursing the land with imperfection. I'm not providing any proof but it's something to think about.I only search for something if I need something. I'm done searching for a source for my questions. Yes, this makes me less open to other ideas but just because I'm done searching doesn’t mean I can't find things.

Yes, humans cooperate naturally. Cooperation can be done for completely selfish purposes though. Cooperation for ones own good has the same characteristics as doing something for the good of mankind, but if someone doesn’t have anything to live for, excluding himself, then he's going to do whatever is for his advantage. A hedonist will do things in secret that hurt others for his own selfish benefit. He does them in secret because he knows he'll be punished by those he hurt. If he's not found out then it looks like he's a cooperative person who benefits the community. The people in that community will accept him, if he's not found out; because it benefits them even though essential he's their demise. This is what can happen if people don't have something to serve but themselves.

I didn’t say there was a direct link between hedonism and saying that you're just physical but that it's merely a reasonable and probable resultant.If you don't believe in a God then who sets the laws of morality? Who says you're responsibly? After all you believe there’s no higher authority to tell you these things, no? If there's no after life and if you don't have any obligations to a higher authority why should you care to leave the place neat when your personal chunk of matter ceases to operate as we think it should. If you don't have a soul then really when the evolved matter know as "you" "dies" nothing has really died or been eradicated it has just lost its unity. If you don’t believe in a higher calling then what makes you feel obligated to help the next man on the line have a pleasing life? I think that humans have this instinct because they are told by their conscience (also known as the Holy Spirit) to do what is moral and just even though there is no real reason here on earth to do so. Why does someone feel guilty if they tell a lie that no one will know? And what's guilt?You're right, evolution has no ties to morality but it does have laws, at least what I've studied of it. Things are supposed to be evolving into better things. I guess it's all what form of evolution you believe.

I wasn't implying that you're a full hedonist. I don't think anyone is. But in a co-operative world there is room for some hedonism and the society still holds together.True man can set rules but the rules of this nation were by God. The founders of our land prayed and used the Bible to set up laws. Most of the most ridiculous court orders are made when they use mans ruling rather than the ones set up originally.The conscience we go by is not just what we've been told, it's what we believe. I grew up in a conservative fundamentalist church. I didn't agree with everything they taught even though that was the only option they gave me. I believed what my conscience told me and I found out later that's what the Bible really meant. Also if I had chosen to believe the conservatists or not it wouldn't have helped me here on earth. I was not swayed by what would serve my body best. Our conscience can be seared but before it is I think we all have a universal moral code. Why would a rich man who is all set need to give to society, he doesn’t need what they can give him. Who cares if society hates him he's still outdone the rest of them when it comes to succeeding. Since some rich men do give without expectation of return where does this appreciation come from? I don't believe that appreciation with no expectation of a return can be explained scientifically. If I'm wrong tell moi.I believe that God gives us a chance to come to Him and the Holy Spirit helps us do that. If we ignore our conscience then eventually God leaves it up to us to find him and the Spirit stops tugging at our hearts. I cannot prove this but observe someone who's cheating. Society doesn't teach that it's bad to do certain things if no one knows and it doesn’t directly affect anyone so when they start doing that thing why do they feel guilty and then eventually forget about it. It's not like they've tested and disproved something that society teaches so they can do it without them being bothered by their conscience.Sure not every evolutionist is going to believe that things are always getting better, or changed to adapt to their surroundings, but according to the evolutionary tree I don't see any species falling to a lower branch. I don’t think that if an animal degraded it would die out either because the species before them didn't die out did they? If you believe a species can go up couldn't it go down? It's more likely for a negative change to happen. The gene pool is getting worse and worse and we progress through time. If you believe uniformitarity, and since we're getting worse genetically, then wouldn't all species have gotten worse genetically? I don't know that you believe uniformitarity but this is in case you do.

Behaving well doesn't require force. We behave well because we believe we should. God makes me believe the things I do but not forcefully.I do believe that man can come up with a system of morality. They've done it before but almost always they're originally based on something religious. When they're not based on that then it's for the good of the people in the society. But what makes you believe that you should help the next man down the line? If you believe that when you die nothing happens after that why should you care how you leave the place? It's certainly not serving you or making you happier when you’re dead.

Also in Monopoly there's no governing authority.Why in good reason would God let himself be elected to a position set by man? God's way of dealing with people is far more advanced than confinement and besides God works through people usually. If He feels like a person should be put in jail then He'll find a way to put him there. I can't prove this but I've experienced it myself. Our society’s laws were set by men who believed in God and based it on Him, but sadly it has corrupted through man.Yes, it makes sense to do good to those who could help you. But when you're dead what good can man do you? If I didn't believe in an afterlife and consequence after life then I'd make a mad dash for money when I'm young and slowly live my life away in pleasure not at the mercy of anyone. What's your incentive for leaving the place nice when you're dead? If you were just purely selfish, no conscience at all, wouldn't you completely steal everything away from those weaker than you if those in authority of you didn't mind? This country has rules (based on the Bible) preventing that so if you were completely living for self then you would go somewhere where you could take from the weak and have no one stronger than you steal from you. I'm sure there are places where this could happen.You said that if everybody is nice to each other then everybody wins. What would you mean by win?I do believe that everyone has the Holy Spirit but it leaves after it is ignored a certain amount of times.

Thank you for your advice. I'm trying to understand what atheism really is because I'm not very familiar with it very much. I'm learning a whole lot as I go along here too so bare with me.I'll try to rephrase what I mean. In monopoly there's nothing to force you into doing something or judge you when you're done with the game. In life there's no authority to force you to do things but I do believe in a judgement afterwards. I believe this is why humans have the instinct to ask for forgiveness from someone.Also, if it really matters, in letter 36 I wrote "They've" because I myself haven't set any moral standards for society.-This part is in response to message 39God doesn't force how we behave but rather He forces situations and influences into our life to either bring us to Him or help us learn. By knowing Him better I know what he wants better. Sometimes we misinterpret the situations He sends us and we think that He is punishing us. The best way to know how you'll do avoiding temptations is to buil your immunity up by going through trials.

oops. Just in case of any miscommunication I meant to write- "Also, if it really matters, in letter 36 I wrote "They've" because I myself haven't set any moral standards for society." at the end of the last message so it applied to Dan's response.