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Author | Topic: Christianity and the End Times | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
It's the GOD Calvin markets that is evil, vile and despicable as well as the theology. Calvinism is without a doubt the the most vile religion worshiping the most vile God ever marketed by man.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: As I keep saying, in the end we are responsible for the choice, we can accept or reject it, and nobody knows whether Tangle is predestined to salvation or not. If Tangle is predestined for salvation and he continues to reject Christianity in any and all of its many flavors...Calvinism says Tangle will be saved. If Tangle is predestined for damnation and he accepts Christianity in any any of its many flavors...Calvinism says Tangle will be damned. That is what ones gets from a vile evil theology that worships a vile evil God like Calvinism.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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Tangle writes: Now, with this predestination crap, it seems that both of us might be surprised, but for different reasons. Back to Matt 25 and the sheep & goats. Both get surprised; those that claimed "When have we not done for you?" as well as those who asked "What the hell have I ever done for you?".
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: jar writes: Some would argue that once a person believes, they experience a "get saved" moment which lasts. I certainly did and so did Faith. Are you suggesting we were merely brainwashed into a conformational bias? (I would defend the change I experienced though acknowledging that it is far from complete) How does a supernatural creature exist in this current realm and how could anyone tell? But what changed Phat? You have said many times your behavior did not change.
Phat writes: jar writes: Just drink the kool-aid already and quit demanding a chemical analysis of its contents! sheesh! (kidding... ) You suggest others should strive for some communion with Jesus. How? But are you kidding? Isn't that exactly what happens?
Phat writes: jar writes: Once you have drank the kool-aid we can all become as one and market a God together rather than you continuing to be a stick-in-the-mud and suggesting that the Emperor is not really wearing anything! It's the GOD Calvin markets that is evil, vile and despicable as well as the theology. Calvinism is without a doubt the the most vile religion worshiping the most vile God ever marketed by man. But once again, you misrepresent what I say. I only say that in the stories the Emperor is wearing what the stories say the Emperor is wearing but I have no idea what the Emperor is wearing outside the stories.
Phat writes: jar writes: Which is fine as long as you quit arguing that the source is unimportant. (yes, ringo...message vs messenger!) Back to Matt 25 and the sheep & goats. Both get surprised; those that claimed "When have we not done for you?" as well as those who asked "What the hell have I ever done for you?". But why is the source important? The Sheep did nothing for Jesus.
Phat writes: Yet if I "threw Him away" what would we even talk about except your infamous charge to go feed the hungry and not worry about a correct religion
jar writes: I'm not feeling it. Would that be so bad? So once again, the theology needs to be what you want it to be; what you create.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Of course the Bible directly contradicts the point of view that whatever happens is God's will. That position can only be supported by taking a few passages out of context, by "Proof Texts". It just makes God look stupid and evil.
If everything happens by God's will why was it necessary for God to go Walkabout to find out what was happening in Babel; why was the Flood necessary, why did Eve eat the apple...? Sorry but that is just another example of humans creating a God to fit the dogma of their Cult.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Maybe actually look at the source material?
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
But the only available source for information on the Judaic and Christian God is the stories in the Bible and Qur'an.
What do they say? AbE: When you look at the descriptions of God in the Bible stories you do see that the authors did let their imagination run wild. Edited by jar, : see AbE:
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Is it so bad to seek communion through prayer and meditation? Do you know what "communion" even means? We can be in communion with others humans. But how can we be in communion with anything spiritual?
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: The Bible presents God in human terms to make Him more understandable, but those terms are a concession to our inability to grasp such a Being as He really is. But the Bible presents God as not being omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent. Have you ever actually read the Bible Faith?
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Have you ever read the Bible, jar? yes Phat, and the point is that the Bible stories present not just conflicting positions, not just conflicting descriptions of God, not just conflicting creation and flood myths, not just conflicting versions of the evnt on the Road to Damascus or the Great Commission but mutually exclusive versions.
Phat writes: I keep asking jar to at least play along and imagine the God of the Nicene Creed rather than a fumbling newbie learning on the job...but he seems to prefer presenting the newbie to us for some strange reason! The Nicene Creed is another creation of humans; it is NOT Biblical based but rather political in nature and a creation from hundreds of years after Jesus death. In addition, the God of the Nicene Creed most definitely excludes the Jesus so many Christian Market.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: 1) Is the end times inevitable or are they simply a clever marketing ploy? And the answer depends on what you think "the End Times" mean. Remember as in all other instances the Bible provides contradictory and mutually exclusive description of what the End Times means and has constantly revised those to try to keep up with reality. The Jewish concept of End Times as found in the Old Testament is nothing like ANY of the ones marketed by Christianity. So far every single End Time marketed by Christianity has failed to happen. There is absolutely no evidence that any of the many End Times prophecies or scenarios market by Christianity are likely to happen. But there is overwhelming evidence that humans are very likely to become extinct and sooner rather than later in evolutionary time spans. There is even stronger evidence that this solar system will come to an end. And most of the evidence seems to point to this universe coming to an end eventually.
Phat writes: 2) If God didn't exist, would humans still be capable (and perhaps likely) to foster their own demise? Watch Jonathan Haight's video for some clues. Whether God exists or not, humans most certainly are still be capable (and perhaps likely) to foster their own demise and there is NO evidence that God would intervene in anyway. There is also overwhelming evidence we are trying very hard to foster our own and well as most other species demise. There is no need to watch ANY video for those things to be obvious.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
The fact remains that everything in Revelation is still just more failed prophecy.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Amazing how much shit Jonathan Cahn can not just make up but how many people ignorant enough to buy into his fantasy he can find.
Apologetics == Let's rewrite the Bible to fit our fantasy.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: I bet you never even heard of Jonathan Cahn until now, and certainly bet that you didn't listen to one word of the interview. Of course I did not listen to the interview, partly because I have heard of Jonathan Cahn but mostly because I have read the Bible and do know both history and reason and understand his basic premise is dishonest, sopomoric and could only be marketed to the willfully ignorant who are totally disconnected from all reality. Just because a Roman Arch is used as support for a bridge or door does not make it Rome. Just because some words were adopted from Greek and Latin does not make them Rome. The man is simply another carny apologist and no thinking person could ever take anything he says seriously.
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: I find it quite compelling no matter how old it is. Why do you find it compelling rather than simply stupid Faith?
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