How does one distinguish faith from delusion?

Sure it is. If you believe in something that has absolutely no evidence then you are delusional. People have been trying to show me evidence for years. It is not evidence it is faith. Faith that goes against all the five senses. Until you can show proof it is delusion in my book.By the way, what is "more to life"? What "more" do people want? An afterlife? My life has plenty of meaning without a belief in the supernatural. I do not have to have some delusional faith in order to live a good moral life.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

True but we have measuring devices that allow us to use our 5 senses to detect these "phenomena".Are you implying that faith is caused by some sort of non-discovered physical phenomena?

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

How is Atheism faith? You seriously think faith can be defined in not believing in something? Atheism is the lack of faith.Let me make it easy. Faith is believing in something without any evidence.Atheists follow the evidence. Which makes us not have faith because there is no evidence.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

There are many refutations of Pascal's Wager. This is hardly a new thought or argument. I find it quite interesting that an argument from the mid 1600's still gets so much play.There have been many criticism's of Pascal's Wager since it was first introduced. Logical it fails at first blush. It allows 2 choices: belief in the christian god or not. These are not the only possibilities so at initial glance the wager fails.Maybe you mnight want to look at the wiki page to see how the argument fails. Pascal's Wager - Criticisms

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Since there have been many religions throughout history, and therefore many potential gods, some assert that all of them need to be factored into the wager, in an argument known as the argument from inconsistent revelations. This would lead to a high probability of believing in the wrong god, which destroys the mathematical advantage Pascal claimed with his Wager. Denis Diderot, a contemporary of Voltaire, concisely expressed this opinion when asked about the wager, saying "an Imam could reason the same way".[13] J. L. Mackie notes that "the church within which alone salvation is to be found is not necessarily the Church of Rome, but perhaps that of the Anabaptists or the Mormons or the Muslim Sunnis or the worshipers of Kali or of Odin."

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Pascal's Wager suffers from the logical fallacy of the false dilemma, relying on the assumption that the only possibilities are:

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1. a benevolent god exists and punishes or rewards according to one's belief, or
2. a benevolent god does not exist.

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God could either be malevolent or not reward belief. In this view, a benevolent god, by definition, would give priority to the belief of the individual in determining rewards or punishments, rather than basing rewards on the basis of the individual's actions, such as rewarding kindness, generosity, humility or sincerity. Perhaps instead god rewards honest attempted reasoning and indeed might punish blind or feigned faith.

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The wager assumes that one can consciously decide. Critics argue that they cannot do this, and therefore Pascal's Wager could only ever be an argument for feigning belief in God. In addition, an omniscient God would presumably see through the deception.

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How about the Atheist Wager as an alternative?

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You should live your life and try to make the world a better place for your being in it, whether or not you believe in god. If there is no god, you have lost nothing and will be remembered fondly by those you left behind. If there is a benevolent god, he will judge you on your merits and not just on whether or not you believed in him.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

That would be a big no. There is no evidence for a god, so therefore I do not have a belief in a god. There is no evidence for a god, but those that have faith have faith that there is a god. One stance is based on the evidence, the other is based on faith. Big difference.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

So which god am I supposed to believe in? How many gods are you agnostic to? How many are you atheist to?Do you even see the point?Why is unsubstantiated belief in a god exempt from delusion? Why are some people that hear voices termed crazy? But if preachers or George Bush claim to be hearing voices they are exempt from any concerns that they may be delusional?Why does religion get a free pass?

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

Here is an even better idea.Stay on topic.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

I rarely read your posts because they are very long winded. This is not to say that I discount what you say, just that I find your style difficult to read.Here are a couple responses. I venture to guess most atheist would say that there is no reason to believe in a god because there is no evidence. Provide evidence and I am sure many would reconsider their views.Which gods are you agnostic to? Which gods are you atheist to? I have never understood how an atheist could believe in the paranormal. Then again this means actually nothing. What people that claim to be atheist believe means nothing to the definition of atheist. In the same vein one could say the same about anyone that has beliefs that go counter to what they claim to believe. I do not think that people that believe in the paranormal are atheists. They obviously believe in something supernatural, this in my book would discount them from being atheists. Oh please!! Can you make a more generalized, unsubstantiated statement than this? Do I read atheistic and non-christian writers? I sure do. I Have read Dawkins, Harris, Doherty and currently I am reading "The Rejection of Pascal's Wager", by Paul Tobin(doesn't strike me as an atheist). They are not my guru's. They are people that write about things I have an interest in. Do I agree with everything they say? Not at all.I find your comment laughable.Atheism does not have a religious belief system. If it does no one has contacted me. Do you know where they meet? I bet they are a bunch of self righteous asses. Who here has said they were?

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

Good I need a new copy. Signed is cool too. I loaned mine out a while ago and the SOB never returned it. Do we atheist have any way to curse someone? Something like imprecatory prayer.Damn I have been an atheist for over 30 years and never knew I was supposed to have a guru or that we had a creed we had to adhere to. Good thing I had a chance to chat with Bailey.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

Belief and faith are not the same thing. Faith is belief without any underlying evidence.Atheism is not a faith because an atheist takes the fact there is no evidence to have no belief in a god.For example,
Religious person
No evidence of a god, but believes in a godAtheist
No evidence for a god, does not believe in a god.The first is faith, the second is not.Also, faith is based upon a system of religious belief. Show me the system of belief that atheist have>

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

If it cannot be scientifically shown how can it be evidence. Please define evidence.What is historical evidence that cannot be scientifically examined? Anecdotes? Fables?
Pray tell what is experiential or mystical evidence? I agree with Stile. I don't think the word means what you think it means. That word

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

As a person with "faith", you may think non belief in a god is "counter-intuitive", but that is not at all how I or other atheists would see it.
Your beliefs and faith do not trump what others believe, no matter what you think. The problem I see with you and your views is that you totally discount others that have beliefs different than yours. You make blanket statements based upon your world view. Another statement with no support. You may feel there is a relevance to your reality. That does not mean it is truly relevant or that others feel it is relevant.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This is a very good point. In order to get a grasp of how the brain can make people believe or think many strange things, everyone should read the books by Oliver SacksThe brain is a strange and wonderful thing. For many reasons it can distort and alter reality and our perceptions of it.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

I have to go on Stragglers side on this one. He has asked repeatedly for some evidence on an immaterial entity. I agree with him that in order for there to be a difference between faith and delusion there must be some sort of evidence for faith. Is that such a hard concept for the religious people and the deists to accept?Instead of anyone providing any sense of evidence he has been accused of being closed minded and and no thaving any evidence. What kind of evidence is he supposed to show? That people don't have subjective esxperiences? You yourself LindaLou have gone on ad nauseum about what atheists think and believe. Refusing to address his question.Look at the title of the OP. Look at the OP.From the OP People have said they have subjective evidence for faith in an immaterial entity. Is it too much to ask what that evidence is? Why are we supposed to just accept everyone's word for it? If people want to convince us atheists that there is a god and we should have faith, maybe they should start showing some of this super double secret evidence they have.Hell he is even willing to accept subject evidence. That is going farther down the road to mumbo-jumbo land than I would be willing to go.

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

Don't know. Don't care. Maybe if there were some sort of evidence i might entertain the idea. Why would there be a purpose? We exist in order to pass on our genes to the next generation. Is that a purpose? Yeah. I would venture that almost everything is done by free will. That question has no meaning. It is spiritualist mumbojumbo nothing more.I answered. Now Stragglers question to you, any chance you might maqke a stab at answering it?

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Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts