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Author Topic:   Could RNA start life?
dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 31 of 105 (683164)
12-08-2012 9:00 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by PaulK
12-04-2012 1:44 AM


re-RNA is life
We should not be that much reductionist. A molecule is a molecule. And it is yet to be decided that which point in chemical evolution should be looked upon as an interface between chemical evolution and biological evolution.
regards and thanks for the reply.
This message is a reply to:
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 Message 32 by PaulK, posted 12-08-2012 9:05 AM dayalanand roy has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 12572
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 32 of 105 (683165)
12-08-2012 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by dayalanand roy
12-08-2012 9:00 AM


Re: re-RNA is life
I wasn't being reductionist. The point was that at that stage the genotype-phenotype distinction is absent. And since you yourself indicated that you consider the RNA world to contain life, I do not think that you can reasonably criticise me for following your lead.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by dayalanand roy, posted 12-08-2012 9:00 AM dayalanand roy has responded

Replies to this message:
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dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 33 of 105 (683166)
12-08-2012 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by RAZD
12-04-2012 2:09 AM


Re: abiogenesis
Many thanks for educating me and eliminating my doubts. However, I am unable to follow exactly your posting tips.
regards.
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by RAZD, posted 12-08-2012 7:26 PM dayalanand roy has acknowledged this reply

    
dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 34 of 105 (683167)
12-08-2012 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by PaulK
12-08-2012 9:05 AM


Re: re-RNA is life
Yes, of course at that time, genotype-phenotype distinction was absent. 'How life originated' is such a complicated problem that we should be very cautious, question hundred times every answer before reaching any final answer. This is my sole purpose in raising these isssues. Your suggestions, however, have done great help to me.
Many thanks and regards.
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dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 35 of 105 (683168)
12-08-2012 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by PaulK
12-08-2012 9:05 AM


Re: re-RNA is life
Yes, of course at that time, genotype-phenotype distinction was absent. 'How life originated' is such a complicated problem that we should be very cautious, question hundred times every answer before reaching any final answer. This is my sole purpose in raising these isssues. Your suggestions, however, have done great help to me.
Many thanks and regards.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by PaulK, posted 12-08-2012 9:05 AM PaulK has not yet responded

    
dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 36 of 105 (683169)
12-08-2012 9:37 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by nwr
12-04-2012 7:10 AM


metabolism first
Great, I too believe in this school of thought, but simply on the basis of some reasoning and intution. I am craving to find some evidences in favor of this theory. I am looking for a suitable mentor and a suitable place to do it. regards.
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dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 37 of 105 (683178)
12-08-2012 11:33 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by nwr
12-04-2012 3:55 PM


metabolism without catalysis
Enzymes are merely required to speed up a reaction as most of the reacting molecules have energy levels much below the transition state. Is it not possible that in the primitive earth conditions, molecules were associated with higher energy levels so as to react easily without the help of an enzyme? Another possibility could be this- It is actually the three dimensional structure, the conformation of the enzyme (along with some functional groups present on it) that creates the enzymatic property of an enzyme. Is it not possible that when the substrate molecules got their shapes, their surrounding molecules acquired an anti-shape, formed some pseudo-enzyme and catalyzed the associated substrate in a manner a modern enzyme does. Later on, when amino acids were developed, those pseudo-enzymes worked as casts to mould amino acids into enzymes. This moulding could have passed through several trial and errors unless a particular sequence of amino acids came into being that fitted into that cast of pseudo-enzyme and thus, a true enzyme could have been formed. This is only a speculation, subject to serious criticism, as there are no proofs. regards
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RAZD
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Posts: 18257
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 38 of 105 (683227)
12-08-2012 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by dayalanand roy
12-08-2012 9:14 AM


Re: abiogenesis
Hi again dayalanand roy,

... However, I am unable to follow exactly your posting tips.
regards.

When you look at the top right coner of the block for Message you're replying to: you will see two radio buttons, on for Normal (default) and one for Peek Mode: -- change to peek mode and you can see how the message you're replying to was formated.

Also see Posting Tips

Enjoy


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Saiyan
Junior Member (Idle past 1508 days)
Posts: 1
Joined: 12-08-2012


Message 39 of 105 (683562)
12-11-2012 5:03 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by dayalanand roy
12-04-2012 12:50 AM


The analogy of RNA as some sort of storage "device" is irrelevant. Nature didn't create anything, but rather RNA resulted from the accumulation of proteins and phosporus bonds in a complex structure which resulted in RNA. It's not as if these proteins became RNA with the "intention" of becoming living. Complexity is a natural result of trillions of random and complex combinations. Life could also potentially be the result of other unknown combinations which form from other elements. It neither proves nor disproves your position of theism.
This message is a reply to:
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crashfrog
Inactive Member


Message 40 of 105 (683563)
12-11-2012 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Saiyan
12-11-2012 5:03 PM


RNA isn't made out of protein.
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1.61803
Member
Posts: 2674
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 41 of 105 (683566)
12-11-2012 6:04 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by crashfrog
12-11-2012 5:30 PM


DOH!!!!!

"You were not there for the beginning. You will not be there for the end. Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative" William S. Burroughs

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dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 42 of 105 (683610)
12-12-2012 8:36 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by PaulK
12-08-2012 9:05 AM


Re: re-RNA is life
Thanks and regards
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dayalanand roy
Junior Member (Idle past 967 days)
Posts: 18
Joined: 11-27-2012


Message 43 of 105 (683614)
12-12-2012 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 39 by Saiyan
12-11-2012 5:03 PM


RNA vs Proteins
RNA does not results from combination of proteins and phosphorus.
It is sugar+phosphate+base.
And science has reached a stage where we are bound to think towards an anthropic universe.
regards
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sunshaker
Member (Idle past 162 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 44 of 105 (694808)
03-29-2013 6:48 AM
Reply to: Message 43 by dayalanand roy
12-12-2012 9:05 AM


Re: RNA vs Proteins
While recently expanding the periodic table, i realised that i could put multiple tables together,
While each single table was just a group of elements, when they join together they reminded me of rna/dna,
It was the joining that creates a reaction throughout both tables/strands as the elements are reshuffled to form a balance,
As shown at elements 167/172.
http://alphaomegadotme.files.wordpress.com/...anded11111.xls
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Admin
Director
Posts: 12436
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 45 of 105 (694844)
03-29-2013 1:56 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by sunshaker
03-29-2013 6:48 AM


Sunshaker Suspended 24 Hours
You posting cluelessly without regard to topic. To prevent more damage I'm suspending you for 24 hours.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

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