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Author Topic:   Net Neutrality --- For Once, Everyone Wins
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 31 of 44 (751184)
02-28-2015 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by NoNukes
02-28-2015 11:54 AM


Re: Pay per Ad Internet
For the most part, employers who cut hours and blamed it on ACA were full of crap.

Agreed.

I don't blame ACA for those actions.

Neither do I.

You are not providing an argument or an explanation. You are just asserting stuff.

Of course.

I'm just giving an opinion based on how weaselly big companies are.

The service providers have already demonstrated that they do not require government excuses to pass on high costs and poor service to customers.

Sure. But they can do even more of it if they can blame it on the government; and they might create a few Rediculouscans in the process.

What I am asking is an explanation of why customers should expect worse from ISPs under net neutrality than without net neutrality.

I don't know if they should expect it, but I can see it happening. It also depends a lot on one's idea of what 'worse' is in regards Internet access.

Why isn't the answer to bad service and high prices increasing competition rather than giving ISPs more leverage to over charge?

Increasing competition is one way to go; it is definitely preferable to the current system. Alternatively, a system similar to how utilities are run (with heavy regulation in the form of price controls and service standards) might not be too bad either.

The new rules are likely a good thing overall.

But being good overall doesn't stop ISPs from jacking up rates just for fun and blaming the government for it.


Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by NoNukes, posted 02-28-2015 11:54 AM NoNukes has acknowledged this reply

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 32 of 44 (751185)
02-28-2015 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by New Cat's Eye
02-28-2015 12:04 PM


Re: Pay per Ad Internet
That's still better than what would happen if we didn't have net neutrality.

Probably. But other people might have different opinions on it.

Either way, it seems a possible scenario. Do you disagree with that?


Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-28-2015 12:04 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-03-2015 2:34 PM Jon has responded

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 33 of 44 (751506)
03-03-2015 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Theodoric
02-26-2015 11:28 PM


Re: satellite anywhere internet/phone
quote:
Researchers Achieve Record-Smashing Wireless Connection Speeds

Do you know what wireless speeds of one terabit per second gets you? One hundred full-length movies downloaded onto your phone in just three seconds. Researchers in the U.K. are now saying that theyve achieved just that: 1 Tbps over a 5G connection for the first time ever. That's the fastest wireless speed to date.

This is the same capacity as fiber optics but we are doing it wirelessly, Rahim Tafazolli of the 5G Innovation Centre (5GIC) at the University of Surrey tells V3. Their tests were carried out under lab conditions over a distance of 100 meters (328 feet) using transmitters and receivers built at Surrey.

The speed is more than 65,000 times faster than average 4G download speeds (thats just 15 megabits per second, or Mbps). And it also smashes the previous 5G (or fifth generation) speed record achieved last October in tests: Samsung's 7.5 gigabits per second (Gbps), BBC reports, is less than one percent of the Surrey team's speed.


This is why satellite (or solar powered drone dirigibles) will beat out wire\cable\optic systems -- they can upgrade easier without having to replace transmission lines.

Enjoy.


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Theodoric, posted 02-26-2015 11:28 PM Theodoric has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Theodoric, posted 03-03-2015 2:41 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply
 Message 37 by Tangle, posted 03-03-2015 2:44 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11839
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 34 of 44 (751512)
03-03-2015 2:34 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by Jon
02-28-2015 3:07 PM


Re: Pay per Ad Internet
Either way, it seems a possible scenario. Do you disagree with that?

I already explained to you that all you have to do is call them up and bitch a fit and then they'll lower the cost.

You might have to threaten cancelling your service, that one always gets them - "oh look, I just found a promotional package that will cut your bill down by X%"


This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by Jon, posted 02-28-2015 3:07 PM Jon has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by Jon, posted 03-03-2015 5:35 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11839
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 35 of 44 (751513)
03-03-2015 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dr Adequate
02-26-2015 2:11 PM


Coyote, Faith, Catholic Scientist, Percy, are you with me?

I just noticed my (old) name...

I've always supported net neutrality.

(BTW, I'm not a Republican)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-26-2015 2:11 PM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 5772
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 9.6


Message 36 of 44 (751515)
03-03-2015 2:41 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by RAZD
03-03-2015 2:16 PM


Re: satellite anywhere internet/phone
quote:
Their tests were carried out under lab conditions over a distance of 100 meters (328 feet) using transmitters and receivers built at Surrey.

They have a long way to go to get to Satellite transmissions distances. I realize that Satellite is on the map for 5G but until we see some real world results it is all pie in the sky. There have been lots of technologies that started out well in the lab but were unable to exist in real world applications. Remember LightSquared?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by RAZD, posted 03-03-2015 2:16 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

    
Tangle
Member
Posts: 5233
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 37 of 44 (751517)
03-03-2015 2:44 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by RAZD
03-03-2015 2:16 PM


Re: satellite anywhere internet/phone
There are lots of problems with satellite; they're expensive, hard/impossible to maintain and upgrade (software apart), they don't scale (they're tiny in comparison to a data centre), power, resilience and redundancy are problems and because of the round trip distance from satellite to earth station, they have very high latency which makes real time applications like telephony and multiplayer games unworkable. (Until we find a way to send data faster than light speed, this can not be fixed.)

Their strengths are in delivering asynchronous media using single transmissions to many points simultaneously - ie broadcast. Using them for many individual, independent, streams ie narrowcast is very inefficient. I don't see satellite as a credible solution.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by RAZD, posted 03-03-2015 2:16 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 38 of 44 (751547)
03-03-2015 5:35 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by New Cat's Eye
03-03-2015 2:34 PM


Re: Pay per Ad Internet
Okay. That might all be true, but I don't see how it relates to my claim that ISPs might try to raise their rates and blame the government.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-03-2015 2:34 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-03-2015 6:01 PM Jon has not yet responded

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11839
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 39 of 44 (751549)
03-03-2015 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Jon
03-03-2015 5:35 PM


Re: Pay per Ad Internet
Okay. That might all be true, but I don't see how it relates to my claim that ISPs might try to raise their rates and blame the government.

Well, it was a way for you to fight back and get those rates un-raised.

But honestly, why does it even matter that ISPs might try to raise their rates and blame the government?

Is it the raising rates? Or the blaming the government? Or both?

What about it am I supposed to care about?

They've been raising rates left and right already. And what does it matter who they blame?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Jon, posted 03-03-2015 5:35 PM Jon has not yet responded

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 40 of 44 (824189)
11-24-2017 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dr Adequate
02-26-2015 2:11 PM


Neutrality under attack again, from Trump
quote:
John Oliver Wants You to Flood the FCC Website to Save Net Neutrality, Again

The Internet is the repository of all human knowledge and goats singing Taylor Swift songs, said John Oliver on Last Week Tonight, rejoicing in the fact that the Internet is an incredible place. However, according to Oliver, that is threatened by the Trump administrations decision to roll back protections for net neutrality.

Net neutrality could be protected by an act of Congress, but Oliver does not trust this Congress or any Congress to handle such a complex and technical issue. Instead, Oliver believes that anyone who loves the Internet needs to speak up and make sure the FCC knows that net neutrality is important. To make that easy, Oliver bought the website GoFCCYourself.com which leads directly to the FCCs public comment area.


Go to GoFCCYourself.com and click on the [express] link on the right side.

Keep the internet under Title II

ps you need to hit enter after each name you enter


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-26-2015 2:11 PM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 10:51 AM RAZD has responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10225
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 41 of 44 (824193)
11-24-2017 10:51 AM
Reply to: Message 40 by RAZD
11-24-2017 9:58 AM


Re: Neutrality under attack again, from Trump
I sent in my petition. Now let me get this straight----basically, the internet is one of the last bastions of free and unguided media (or data) correct? As it should be. Free to publish Faiths rants, my rants, RAZD lengthy posts, and even porn and propaganda...as it now exists. The Republicans want to change that specifically how, again?

Hmmmm this reminds me of my request to Percy to clean up the archive. I suppose that my inner republican wants to make EvC Forum all neat and tidy, while a proponent of free information would leave every last bit of spam and worthless posts in the database. Given PC vs Free Information, I guess I'm voting for free information.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith :)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 9:58 AM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 1:25 PM Phat has responded

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19295
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 42 of 44 (824203)
11-24-2017 1:25 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Phat
11-24-2017 10:51 AM


Re: Neutrality under attack again, from Trump
... The Republicans want to change that specifically how, again?

Trump wants to undo everything Obama, and that includes undoing protecting the internet under Title II so that the ISPs can't charge different rates for different speeds provided, or even exclude some sites because they don't pay a fee to be available.

Before Obama the internet fell under Title I, and Netscape sued the FCC and won to have tiered service. The judge told the FCC that they needed to be under Title II to protect neutrality, and congress and Obama made it so.

It may be the last straw before people get together and form a crowd internet, certainly in urban areas

http://www.web-strategist.com/...e-app-for-crowd-revolutions

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 10:51 AM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by Phat, posted 11-24-2017 2:38 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply
 Message 44 by Minnemooseus, posted 11-25-2017 12:22 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10225
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 43 of 44 (824208)
11-24-2017 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by RAZD
11-24-2017 1:25 PM


Re: Neutrality under attack again, from Trump
Im really confused now...looks like even The Conservative View supports net neutrality! Where does Trump get off? He is acting more and more like an authoritarian oligarch every day!

Edited by Phat, : No reason given.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
Paul was probably SO soaked in prayer nobody else has ever equaled him.~Faith :)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by RAZD, posted 11-24-2017 1:25 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3580
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 44 of 44 (824224)
11-25-2017 12:22 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by RAZD
11-24-2017 1:25 PM


Re: Neutrality under attack again, from Trump
And who seems to be a biggie, for preserving net neutrality?

https://www.forbes.com/...-facebook-and-amazon/#6f3ba228642c

https://www.washingtonpost.com/...n-wants-to-turn-it-on-them

etc.

Al "Lips" Franken

Moose

ABE:

or it that Al "The Tongue" Franken

Edited by Minnemooseus, : ABE.


This message is a reply to:
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