For ToErs Eyes Only

I think one of the problems with talking to believers is that the belief is often (but not always) tied up in the self perception of the individual. Look at at the 'discourse' among scientist with mutally exclusive ideas: it gets pretty heated.Challenging the belief is like challenging their personal qualities. In my job I can't mention religious beliefs at all! And my job is to look at peoples every day beliefs and perceptions with the intent to alleviate depression and anxiety.It's very hard to change belief. The spectre of "Yes but......" hoves into view. Being English I'm temped to say "Let them beleive what they like" but when I see George W acting like a religious leader with nukes it puts the fear of god into me.What can we do? Moderate our discourse, don't go off topic, stick to one concept in a tread, not have 3+ discussions going on. Spot the logical fallicies and point them out and above all don't go round in circles. If the message is not getting across don't waste your time.Stick to science. I don't think that any creo can stand against the scientific approach. (ok, so thats just my belief)

Is it just me or does debating with anyone with the "godidit" mindset seem a waste of time? We seem to be debating not with the interpretaion of the evidence but with debunking the fundemental mind set of the religous individual.What I mean to say is that here, we could be seen to be argueing against religious belief, not evidence. To a literalist the evidence is irrelevant. One thread I read yesterday said that no other position other than the inerracy of the bible would be taken. Period.Whats the point talking?Sorry, feeling glum.

I think I have to agree with you there. Living in the UK I'm quite happy to let god bother'ers while away many fruitless hours talking about their god.I feel aghast though when I see US schools argueing over whether or not to include creation. America could be a far greater source of scientific and human progress if it devoted less energy to religion and more to pushing forwards.Churning out fundies could cause a theocracy. What then? Book burning? Oops, more to say but have to go......

We tried to deal with them once, but you went and got the French involved.