If we are all descended from Noah ...

If we are all descended from Noah, and Noah had not
only faith in the One God, but proof of his existence ...Why are there religions other than judaism and christianity ?

That's the sort of thing I'm expecting ... but one
always lives in hope

quote:

---

Originally posted by TrueCreation:
Contary to Quetzals input it is the result of diverging cultures and isolated populations as generations pass and cultural biases and beliefs develop.

---

But the whole of the human society would have been founded
by Noah's immediate family, for whom the existence of the One
God was a given fact.ALL human societies would have this as their root. It would not
be forgotten, as it would leave extremely deep rooted biases.IF we are all descended from Noah's family, approx. 4500 years ago,
that means that the Greeks, Druids, Phoenecians, Romans, Norsemen etc. just suddenly decided to make up big Pantheons of Gods.They created religous systems, and mythology, from scratch that
were contrary to their founding father's KNOWLEDGE of what the
case actually was, and against the grain of all of the
deep rooted conventions that make up their whole thought processes.

quote:

---

Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
Another question... How do you know that Buddism and Taoism predate the flood?

---

That is actually a very good question. Could you please tell us
how many years ago the flood happened, providing scientific
evidence to support your claim ?Once you've given us that we can debate which cultures pre-date
the flood.

quote:

---

Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
Allow me to refresh your memory...

​

You stated, "If that is the case how do you explain the existance of religions that predate the flood that are still around today?(Buddism & Taoism for example)"

​

In defense of that question you later stated, "...however the cultures that fostered these religions(Indian, Chinese) do predate the flood..."

​

You made both of these claims regarding cultures predating the flood before any date for the flood was presented in this debate.

---

In general, debate on this forum is between those of us who
accept the cited evidence FOR evolution, and those who hold
Young Earth Creationist positions.In YEC models, the date for the Great Flood is taken to be
4500 yr bp.It does NOT really require a re-statement of that unless one is
being particularly arrogant and/or pedandtic.

quote:

---

Originally posted by w_fortenberry:

If you do not know the date of the flood, how can you claim to know that some cultures predate the flood?

---

Because archeologists, who specialise in dating archeological
finds, have dated many sites to well before 4500 yr bp.BTW -- they do not rely on radiometric dating techniques for this.

quote:

---

Originally posted by w_fortenberry:

Along the same lines if you require a date for the flood in order to obtain definitive evidence for cultures predating the flood, did you make your claims without definitive evidence of their validity, and do you expect others to accept those claims regardless of that absence?

---

We are debating the literal accuracy of the Bible in this thread.According to a literal reading of the Bible the Great Flood happened
4500 yr bp (or thereabouts).Current archeology finds cultures pre-dating this time, still
in existence after this time.

quote:

---

Originally posted by w_fortenberry:

By the way, please notice that I said, "I may get to that eventually."
Please also notice that I have not attempted to impose my will at all within this debate. I have simply expressed curiosity regarding your statements and dissatisfaction with your evidence for those claims. If I were trying to impose my will, I would hope that you would require of me as much evidence as necessary to prove the validity of my position.

---

I would, yes Also, in terms of the antiquity of variuos cultures, there is the
Sumerian Problem.The oldest cities of Sumeria are dated to about 8000 years bp,
but the culture was already sophisticated.

Edited this out ... 'cause I already started another
thread on it and forgot ... had a lot on my mind.Sorry

​

[This message has been edited by Peter, 06-10-2002]

quote:

---

Originally posted by dreaded s flynn:
This topic probably needs it's own thread :^)
But are you aware that the various ancient copies of the book of genesis have various and different lengths of time for dates such as the flood and the creation of man?

---

I wasn't aware of that (as you can see in the other thread), but
for me it casts a deep shadow on any claim to inerrancy for any
version of the bible.A claim I have heard from some christains when tasked with the
problems of translation from one language to another, is that
God guided the translation to make sure it was His word.Did God forget the dates when he was guiding some people ?What else did He forget or omit or exaggerate ?Crossing to the Egyptian thread ... is even 1000 years
sufficient to explain the rise of a poly-theistic religous
belief system (vastly different from judaism), originating
from a line who had first hand knowledge of the One God ?Christainity has survived (with minor modifications) for over
1000 years with much less proof of God than Noah had.

I don't understand this as a response to my earlier post.

Another 'descended from Noah issue' ::If we are all descended from Noah, is 4500 years sufficient
time to get enough diversity in the Y chromosome to be able
to trace which ancestral race the British populations have come
from.This research has been carried out to investigate the genetic
legacy of the Vikings in the British Isles.If there is sufficient time, doesn't that mean that mutations
can and DO occur and that they are not detrimental necessarily ?

Exactly ... and it's even less time for that,
since there were Romans, ethopians, Egyptians, Celts,
Picts, Scots, etc. at least 2000 years ago.All of the races of man (and that's JUST man) would have to
have emerged, by mutation, within 2000 years. And the problem
doesn't go away if the wives were of different races, because
there are distict differences in the Y chromosome across different
races ... and that's ONLY carried by males, which means ALL
Y chromosomes on earth should ultimately be Noah's if we are to
believe the Bible.

I think the literal interpretation for the date
of the flood is 4500 years ago ... that is approx.
2500BC.The Chinese year is up to 4699 or somesuch, and there are one
per western year (averaged over time since they have this
neat leap-month thing going).That's just to recorded Chinese dynasties, and there is a
legendary existence before that that led into the
recorded stuff ... which is entirely believable since cultures
do not arise out of thin air.This puts the start of Chinese culture (recorded) to about
200 years before the flood.

Doesn't the Indus Valley civilisation pre-date
3000BC ... I'll look it up.