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Author | Topic: God says this, and God says that | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: I have your evidence though you will deny it and explain it away. A friend of mine shattered his hip snowboarding, this was the second season in a row he had done so. So he was back in traction in the hospital to have the same hip repaired again. The elders of the church came in to pray for him and the very next day when the doctors took more x-rays the hip was completely healed. Not even traces of the fractures, completely and painlessly healed. I was a counsellor at a bible camp one year, and our counsellors suddenly began to fall ill. Before we knew it we barely had enough staff to continue. We all got together for a prayer meeting, within an hour of this meeting counsellors who had been extremely sick started coming out of the cabins in perfect health. One winter when I was young I remember we had a propane furnace in the little trailer our family was living in. At the beggining of the winter when my dad checked the guage on the propane tank he found that it was nearly empty. My parents were in financial trouble at the time barely finding enough money to keep a few groceries in the cupboards. So unable to afford to fill the propane tank my father just didn't bother looking at the rest of the winter. It was one of the more brutal winters I recall being -40* celcius most of the winter. Our furnace kept on going and going. There is no way that the propane should even have lasted a month let alone the whole winter. Well like the woman and the oil that propane just kept flowing and our furnace kept running, ran all winter. Didn't run out until dad made enough money in the spring to buy some propane. This is God caring for his faithful. Healing the sick, performing modern day miracles. I got lots more johnny if you want pages and pages of miraculous things I have seen God do. Note these are not second hand stories, all personal experience. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: I get mad at any stereotype, and I don't deny the fact that there are some people who proffess to Christianity that portray these characteristics. Even the honest hard working idea is wrong we aren't all honest and hard working. The thing is that we are still human, still tempted in the same ways and we are not perfect. It is insulting to read most of the stuff on your site though I will drop it as it serves no real purpose to continue along this line. Though I find it difficult to do so, I wanted you to admit to how blatantly insulting that site is. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: That's fair John, I didn't think of that when I was posting. I could see if there was any record from the hospital of the most miraculaous of those. Actually just talked to that guy the other day. I do recall though that the doctors were not pleased about the whole thing. That kind of thing doesn't sit well with the sciency types. The other two examples would be hard to document. But these are some of the evidences I personally have of God's hand at work. There are many more but there's not to much point in filling this whole site with these things. This is why a few details that are not very well explained cannot shake my faith. God has left his mark in and around my life, I cannot deny that. It's not that I don't listen to your counter-evidence, just that it holds no weight against the personal evidence. Does that make ANY sense to you? ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: I didn't see a response to this post, though I may have missed it, I just noticed that I've missed quite a bit on this thread. However if I take Chara correctly here I think she was apologizing to you John on behalf of the body of Christ.From your web site I gather that we (the body of Christ) have wronged you over the years obviously more than once, as a member of this body I would like to ask your forgiveness as well. Our Lord Jesus, I'm sure is greatly saddened by what we have done to you, and how we have portrayed him to you. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
Amen and Amen
I agree with that for sure. I was wondering how to address the earning faith thing. Glad you said something. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
Amen and Amen
I agree with that for sure. I was wondering how to address the earning faith thing. Glad you said something. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: It was the word earn that threw me Gene. Our faith grows as we spend time in prayer and study. The longer you walk with the Lord the more you know him. But I believe it's still given to us. I just have a problem with earning anything with God. Hope I don't sound like I'm attacking you Gene, it's just what I believe. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: Just making sure Chara's little nugget of wisdom doesn't get lost here. This is the best answer to the original question that I have seen. ------------------saved by grace [This message has been edited by funkmasterfreaky, 12-13-2002]
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
Sorry John I lost this post, didn't see it. This has been a fairly heated fast moving thread. I've missed quite a few posts had to go back and read through what I've missed.
quote: I'm not sure what you're talking about here. God gets angry at sin yes! Even more so when those who are his servants disobey him. However to those who serve him do so out of free-will. Not just because they live within his borders. This was one of the contrasts I was getting at between the King and earthly kings. God punishes us for disobeying him yes, but out of love not anger. He seeks to correct us not to get revenge.
quote: I was refering to our discussion about free-will, when I had used the analogy of feeding my cat. You had said as soon as God knows what you will choose it's no longer free will. I replied saying, so if I put down food for my cat knowing that he will choose to eat it I have taken away his ability to choose if he will eat it or not. At which point you responded saying, no I could not affect my cat's free will because I was not God. By this logic a man cannot have the same effect on another man as God can. Now for one I was not speaking of an emotional reaction to a book. I was talking about a change in my very nature. Brought about by God. What you were saying about Crowley is an emotional response to a book.I know this is not put well I am struggling to form thought to words (yet again I am frustrated by the limitation of language). I'm saying how can you equate a feeling you got from Crowley's book to a change in nature brought about by God. It's not even in the same league. Arrgghh this is not what I wanted to say. Hopefully your examination and questioning will help me to properly explain what I'm getting at. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
This conversation is weighing very heavy on my heart right now. Though yes I do find John's site offensive, Gene I find the lack of love in your posts lately equally disturbing. I'm not attacking either of you. Please don't take it as such. I know I also have responded in anger in this forum. How can we expect each other to listen to our posts if we continuosly slander each other and bicker. It's like a screaming match. If you are both yelling no-one is listening. If no-one is listening then nothing is being accomplished. This kind of stubborn bickering just leads to anger, not wisdom. When Forgiven appeared on this board he said "come let us reason". If we all put down our pride we will be able to speak with much more wisdom. I mean no offence to anyone. The basis of my faith is love. I believe this to be the basis of the teachings of Jesus Christ. Let's put the weapons down, and reason together, this war amongst each other will serve only to drive each other further away from what we are trying to convey. Maybe it is not my place to say this, and if it wasn't then I ask your forgiveness. I hope I did not sound judgemental.
------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: Thanx for this piece of wisdom Forgiven, I never thought of this, that God just allows us to suffer the consequences of our actions, that the actual punishment is self inflicted, by a bad decision. Then God uses these things to his purpose on my life. I was just thinking of the book of James (one of my favourite) chapter 1: 2Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, 3because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. 4Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. Paul says this almost exact thing in Romans. Anyways thank you Forgiven. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
We are all very good at figuring out what other peoples problems are, let's try looking at our own.
------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: The more I think about that the more I wonder how you can say someone doesn't know how to believe? No offence Robinrohan, it's just spinning my head in circles here. I can see saying someone doesn't know what to believe. I don't remember learning *how* to believe. I guess what I meant by my other comment was that it's easy to see where other peoples failings may be, but it is much more difficult to see your own. ------------------saved by grace
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: Theists are constantly told they have to prove God exists, (in the midst of intellectual slander and accusations of foolishness; these things are commonly directed at theists) while atheist/agnostics for some reason don't have to provide evidence of their faith. I can see why he wants you to admit you are arguing from a faith based position, because it levels the playing field. I tend to agree that if you can't prove God does not exist you cannot try and force a theist to prove that he does. How do you know those blocks aren't there? Obviously the child can see them. Maybe you just can't see them. Can you prove that those blocks aren't there? ------------------saved by grace [This message has been edited by funkmasterfreaky, 12-15-2002]
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: But if I walk up to the door, knock, and it's opened up for me, I do not even have to touch the door knob. I can enter in and never even have had to worry about the mechanics of a latch.
quote: I think your first analogy was much better than this one. A diamond you should be able to easily prove, it being a physical object and all. If the diamond is produced I cannot deny it's existance. Evidence of God has to be evidence of the spiritual affecting the physical, making some sort of impact of the physical. Well now this can be denied, the person can then come up with another possibility in their mind to explain away the very evidence that they seek. This is where the absurdity begins. So the diamond analogy doesn't hold that well.
quote: Why would a kid make a claim to blocks that he knew did not exist? Why would s/he hold to said claim under scrutiny?There must be some reason for the claim. ------------------saved by grace
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