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Author Topic:   Should this guy have served time?
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 31 of 112 (280151)
01-19-2006 11:39 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by berberry
01-19-2006 11:32 PM


Re: What if the judge was pro-heterosexual...
You have a very weird perspective if you think Christians condone and have not prosecuted polygamy and sex with minors.

What about the traditional mormons in Colorado City?

The Mormons were forced to disavow polygamy in order for Utah to be admitted to the union. You think the secularists were the ones insisting on that, and the Christians all favored polygamy? Get real man.

They believe it's okay for adult men to rape 12-year-old girls (I think they have to marry them first, so maybe that's why fundie Christians don't seem to mind).

Weirder by the minute. I hate to break it to you, but fundamentalist Christians tend to be somewhat harsh in their views of what should happen to men that rape little girls, but then again, you probably don't know the difference between a fundamentalist and a non-fundie Christian.

I'm not going to answer you outright

I pretty much figured you would continue to avoid answering the OP, and suspect you will not be censured for it by the mods either.

This message has been edited by AdminPhat, 01-19-2006 11:18 PM


This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by berberry, posted 01-19-2006 11:32 PM berberry has not yet responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 34 of 112 (280155)
01-19-2006 11:45 PM


for jar and others
Note the questions in the OP. Please address them. For example;

Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

jar, berberry, nwr,...what is your answer to this question? Please quit hiding behind claiming you don't know the specifics of this one case. The question is also whether "this type of thing deserves prison?"

Where do you stand?

Yes or no would suffice to start with.

This message has been edited by randman, 01-19-2006 11:46 PM


  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 35 of 112 (280156)
01-19-2006 11:48 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by jar
01-19-2006 11:40 PM


answer the question jar
Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by jar, posted 01-19-2006 11:40 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 01-19-2006 11:52 PM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 37 of 112 (280158)
01-19-2006 11:55 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by jar
01-19-2006 11:52 PM


Mods?
Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

Your response that you don't know the specifics of this one case is not germane to whether you think this type of thing, sex between adult men and teens, deserved prison.

So answer the question.

Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

do you support human rights, randman?

I do, but I do not think, as you apparently do, that it is necessarily a human right for gay men to have sex with male teens. I say "as you do" because I think the only logical conclusion for your reluctance to answer forthrightly is that you must think it is a human right.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 01-19-2006 11:52 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:16 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 38 of 112 (280159)
01-19-2006 11:56 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by nwr
01-19-2006 5:33 PM


u can start with answering basic questions
Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by nwr, posted 01-19-2006 5:33 PM nwr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 12:02 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 40 of 112 (280161)
01-20-2006 12:04 AM
Reply to: Message 39 by nwr
01-20-2006 12:02 AM


Re: u can start with answering basic questions
It's a general question. Do you think statuatory rape between adult men and teen boys, say 15 years old, deserves prison or jail time?

Why won't you answer nwr?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 12:02 AM nwr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 12:30 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 41 of 112 (280162)
01-20-2006 12:09 AM


Tell you what guys....
Here is a story of another judge from a liberal state handing out a light sentence to a male, but one that was heterosexual. Maybe considering this could pry some comments other than obvious obfuscation from you.

Claiming he no longer believes in punishment, a Vermont judge issued a 60-day sentence to a man who confessed to repeatedly raping a girl over a four-year period, beginning when she was 7 years old.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=48219

You think this should deserve prison time? Or that this type of thing deserves prison time?

This message has been edited by randman, 01-20-2006 12:10 AM


  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 43 of 112 (280164)
01-20-2006 12:22 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by jar
01-20-2006 12:16 AM


Re: randman once again misrepresents what people say.
Uh, this is amazing. First you refuse to answer the questions in the OP, and now you want me to apologize. I explained that the only logical reason I could think of for you to not answer the question is that your answer would embarras you. You are the one here talking of human rights in the context of statuatory rape. If you don't feel it is a human right, then all you have to do is tell us what you do think.

But maybe you just feel like diverting threads and that is your motive.

Tell you what. Just tell us what your stance is, and if I have misjudged you, I will gladly retract or change my remarks and judgement, although I think my reason is valid.

So let's try again.

Do you think this sort of thing deserves prison or not?

This message has been edited by randman, 01-20-2006 12:24 AM


This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:16 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:27 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 46 of 112 (280167)
01-20-2006 12:33 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by jar
01-20-2006 12:27 AM


Re: randman once again misrepresents what people say.
jar, for you to talk about basic honesty, imo, is frankly absurd. Either deal with the questions and the topic raised in the OP or get off the thread.

Here is one of the questions, an easy one, again. You should have no problem answering it, and if you were following the forum guidelines in dealing with on-topic discussions, you would, and moreover, if you were a basically honest and decent person, you would answer it as well, or not post on the thread in the first place.

Here it is again.

Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

Is that so hard a thing to answer?

After that, you might consider this one.

Is there a double-standard as some female teachers have been more severely prosecuted for sex with their teen students?

I will await your reply.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:27 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:38 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 47 of 112 (280168)
01-20-2006 12:36 AM
Reply to: Message 45 by nwr
01-20-2006 12:30 AM


Re: u can start with answering basic questions
Can you please show where either of those posts answers whether you feel statuatory rape for adult homosexual men and teen-age boys should, in general or even sometimes, result in prison time?

I could not find anything in those posts that stated your views on the issue, as a general issue.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 12:30 AM nwr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 1:03 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 49 of 112 (280171)
01-20-2006 12:41 AM
Reply to: Message 48 by jar
01-20-2006 12:38 AM


Mods?
Jar, this is the OP.

Pathiakis, who quit his job after school officials questioned his extracurricular contact with students, was arrested in January 2004 after a 15-year-old boy told authorities the Middleboro High School teacher raped him Dec. 23, 2003.

Massacusetts Superior Court Chief Justice Suzanne Delvecchio

Prosecutors asked Brockton Superior Court Judge Suzanne V. Delvecchio to give Pathiakis four to eight years in state prison, followed by five years probation. But she issued a suspended, 2 1/2-year jail term, followed by five years probation.

Delvecchio, the first woman to be appointed chief justice of the Massachusetts Superior Court, was honored in 2000 as the keynote speaker at the Massachusetts Gay and Lesbian Bar Association's annual dinner.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=48397

Note: the sex was consensual, but the boy was 15. Some questions:

1. Is there a double-standard as some female teachers have been more severely prosecuted for sex with their teen students?

2. Is the judge, being gay, not being objective, and should she have recused herself considering her pro-homosexual activities, even if just for appearance's sake?

3. Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

4. Is lighter sentencing in this area a move towards accepting homosexual sex between teens and adults? Historically, in some areas of the world, such as with the pashas in Afghanistan, homosexual sex between teens and adults has been somewhat socially accepted and at times widespread. Is it a fantasy for conservative outlets like WND to decry this as a general move, or an accurate reflection of where society is heading in normalizing homosexuality.

What part of this topic do you not understand? Thus far, you have studiously posted with complete disregard and avoidance of the OP, imo.

How about answering the questions?

Also, if you do not think homosexual sex between adult men and 15 year old boys is a human right, just say so. I have no desire to mischaracterize you.

Is that what you believe? Or do you think sexual rights extent to consensual sex between adults homosexuals and willing teens?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:38 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:44 AM randman has responded
 Message 52 by AdminAsgara, posted 01-20-2006 12:49 AM randman has responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 51 of 112 (280173)
01-20-2006 12:48 AM
Reply to: Message 50 by jar
01-20-2006 12:44 AM


Re: Mods?
Note: the sex was consensual, but the boy was 15. Some questions:

1. Is there a double-standard as some female teachers have been more severely prosecuted for sex with their teen students?

2. Is the judge, being gay, not being objective, and should she have recused herself considering her pro-homosexual activities, even if just for appearance's sake?

3. Does this type of thing deserve prison or jail-time?

4. Is lighter sentencing in this area a move towards accepting homosexual sex between teens and adults? Historically, in some areas of the world, such as with the pashas in Afghanistan, homosexual sex between teens and adults has been somewhat socially accepted and at times widespread. Is it a fantasy for conservative outlets like WND to decry this as a general move, or an accurate reflection of where society is heading in normalizing homosexuality.

What part of these questions do you not understand, jar?

As far as retracting my assessment of what you seem to have claimed, are you claiming you do not claim or do claim sexual rights between teen and adult males?

All you have to do is answer the question. I am perfectly willing to accept whatever you say your stance is. You avoided answering the basic issue, and behaved in a manner suggesting you feel it is a human right, or so it appears to me. I don't think I owe you an apology.

If you are saying I misunderstand your position and want to clarify and tell me what your position is, please do so. I cannot think of why any decent and honorable person would not clarify their position so as to avoid any confusion.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 12:44 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by jar, posted 01-20-2006 1:35 AM randman has not yet responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 53 of 112 (280175)
01-20-2006 12:52 AM
Reply to: Message 52 by AdminAsgara
01-20-2006 12:49 AM


Re: Mods?
Lacking knowledge of the specifics of this case does not prevent one from answering other parts of the OP such as whether one thinks statuatory rape among homosexual adults and male teens deserves prison time.

The fact is we don't know the specifics of nearly anything reported in the media, such as the evidence for going to Iraq, the terror threat, and all sorts of things, but that does not prevent discussion of them.

I think I laid out in a very reasonable manner some questions for discussion.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by AdminAsgara, posted 01-20-2006 12:49 AM AdminAsgara has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by Nuggin, posted 01-20-2006 1:34 AM randman has not yet responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 54 of 112 (280176)
01-20-2006 1:01 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by berberry
01-19-2006 11:32 PM


Re: What if the judge was pro-heterosexual...
Looks to me like judges are going pretty light on heterosexual offenders. Watch O'Reilly's show if you don't believe me.

Ok, berberry, here is a transcript.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,182150,00.html

A Vermont judge next door btw to Massuchusetts ruled as follows:

Claiming he no longer believes in punishment, a Vermont judge issued a 60-day sentence to a man who confessed to repeatedly raping a girl over a four-year period, beginning when she was 7 years old.

Do you think this was right or that such things as molesting a 7 year old should result in prison time?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by berberry, posted 01-19-2006 11:32 PM berberry has not yet responded

  
randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3072 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 56 of 112 (280178)
01-20-2006 1:09 AM
Reply to: Message 55 by nwr
01-20-2006 1:03 AM


Re: u can start with answering basic questions
How about in general? We never know all the specifics, period, from just reading the news, and heck, sometimes even the court never finds out all the specifics, and the specific facts that are made known are incomplete, but that doesn't mean we cannot discuss something or make a qualified judgment.

I asked out of sincerety, trying to move the topic along. I really want to know.

Do you and others here as well think that, in general, consensual sex between a 15 year old boy and an adult homosexual should be punishable by prison? If you say it depends on the specifics, fine. You can say it depends. Sometimes you think it is OK, or just a minor offense, and other instances, something deserving prison, or whatever you do think.

I also asked if you thought the 60 day sentence for the man that molested the 7 year old was appropiate. Actually, it was over a 4 year period.

What's so hard about just answering and giving your views on such things? If you don't want to do that, why be on the thread at all?

This message has been edited by randman, 01-20-2006 01:11 AM


This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 1:03 AM nwr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by nwr, posted 01-20-2006 1:34 AM randman has not yet responded
 Message 60 by Silent H, posted 01-20-2006 7:57 AM randman has responded

  
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