Fundamentalists (of all stripes) at it again (Re: Textbook Wars: Religion in History)

as usual, the devil will be in the details.Hopefully the final result will be a more honest representation of what happened. If all that gets accomplished is that we get a better picture of history, that it was more complex, with fewer cultural rewrites, it will have been worthwhile.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

An unnamed Christian minister, who is a friend of a friend, says that 30 years ago you didn't hear of jihad in Pakistan.Well, that certainly supports your assertions about Sudan. How could anyone deny that? At some unknown time on some unknown NPR program a somewhat (whatever the hell that means) academic in some unnamed field said basically what randaman asserts. Or so he claims. So randman resorts to innuendo and implication instead of providing the documentation he claims is out there.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

It's time that, at least here in the US, we began teaching what actually happened. We need to quit revising our own history and begin admitting the absolutely horrible things that the US has done in the past, from Andrew Jackson's blatant refusal to obey the laws of the land, to the stealing and conquest of Hiwaii, to the horrors of United Fruit Company, the conspiricy of major corporatioins that doomed the rail and trolley systems in our urban areas, to the theft of Panama, the governments we've overthrown, the despots we've supported, the terrorists we've trained and the horrific treatment of our Native Americans.We need to realize that if this is a Christian Nation, then it has been responsible for some of the worst genocide in history.Until we can look at our own history and be honest about both the good and the bad, we are fated to continue committing some of the worst attrocities of all time.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

You have asserted that people try to hide the fact that Livingston was a missionary but have offered no such evidence. There is no doubt that his first trip to Africa was missionary, and when he came back, he published a best selling book and went on the lecture circuit.His next two trips were primarily exploratory and the third in particular, was specifically to search for the headwaters of the Nile.Now I think it's time that you showed your evidence that there is some secular plot to hide the fact that David Livingston was a missionary or to retract your assertions.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Buz.I happen to think that sacred studies should be part of a general publlic school curricula. see Message 1But don't we need to teach all of the history as it really happened. Don't we also need to teach all of the horrific acts committed in the name of Christianity as well as the good influences? And when looking at other religions, don't we also need to include both the good and the evil?If we are going to teach the history of religion (and since religions do play such an important part in forging civilizations I think it's important) don't we also have to teach the fact that the Crusades were an act of naked aggression against a relatively peaceful community, that the Christian religion drove us to destroy the history, culture and even language of millions?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

your link does not support your assertion. What the student claims is that Religious Studies, Church History, are being taught as Religious Studies or Philosophy.Surprised?How does this support secularization in anyway?The only place that the student makes anything that approaches a supported statement involves the decision to not replace a retired professor. In that one case, the reason is asserted to be that it was not "fashionable". Frankly, that implies there would not be enough students paying for the course to support the costs.As you should know from reading my threads and posts here at EvC, I support the idea that Sacred Studies should be part of every general education, from the lowest grades right on through advanced education. But we should also teach the histroy of what really happened and not some sanitized version. It's important for example, to show that historically, Christianity has been if not the least tolerant of all religions, one of the least tolerant.Christianity has contributed much, and certainly it has been a driving force forming the world we see today. However that influence was not always benign.Are you and other Christians willing to see the actual history taught the way it happened, to show both sides of the issue, the good and bad, the warts and wonders?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Once again your example does not support your assertions.The evolutionists did not use that case to get evolution accepted into school curriculums.Teaching Evolution was already in the school curriculums, and the religous conservatives used the Government to have teaching Evolutionary Theories proscribed. Tennesse StatuteThe statute was specifically inserted to prevent teaching evolutionary theory. The teacher was charged with violating the statute. It was not the evolutionists who tried to use the courts to get the subject taught, but the religious conservatives that used the courts and legislature to KEEP the subject from beling taught.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Sorry, but once again your post is nothing but errant nonsense and willfull ignorance. The religious right wrote the law, and brought the charges and won the case. They tried to impose ignorance on all of the students of Tennessee.The rest of your post is simply more OT nonsense.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

In addition, the practices of indulgences as well as other issues WERE reformed by the Roman Catholic Church during the Council of Trent. One of the other big issues was related to Absentee Bishops and that was also addressed.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion