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Member (Idle past 3942 days) Posts: 2657 From: A Better America Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Romney the Bully | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
subbie Member (Idle past 1285 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
Curiously, you pointed out that Obama did this in his book, but have not shown that Romney has even begun to discuss this with the seriousness that it should require, especially today when bullying is beginning to see much long needed attention. That's because he's not here to defend Romney. He's here to try to divert attention from Romney.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1055 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined:
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Whilst I would agree that this banging on relentlessly about some teenage bullying decades ago is a piece of political theatre, and not at all relevant, it's not at all the same as Obama's drug use. The simplest reason being that bullying is something we all consider wrong, whilst drug use is something most of us have no problem with, and some of us engage in ourselves.
The US needs some big group of Republican congressmen coming out and saying they used to smoke weed, like a bunch of leading Conservative Party MPs did in the UK when terrifying reactionary Ann Widdecombe proposed some draconian crackdown or other. It would be cathartic.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined:
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They need to decriminalize or legalize it.
But the anti-drug war is a big business now, so don't look for that any time soon.
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subbie Member (Idle past 1285 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
They need to decriminalize or legalize it. But the anti-drug war is a big business now, so don't look for that any time soon. And yet here you are, trying to distract us from conduct by Romney that no reasonable person would find defensible with conduct by Obama that you yourself think should be decriminalized. Wow, the cognitive dissonance is strong in this one. Edited by subbie, : TyopRidicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
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Rahvin Member Posts: 4046 Joined: Member Rating: 8.3 |
They need to decriminalize or legalize it. But the anti-drug war is a big business now, so don't look for that any time soon. It's funny. This is one of the few topics that I see lots of support for amongst both the far right and the "liberal commies," and yet the idea is absolutely untouchable for any politician. Just seems to show that, as you say, "big business" is what drives the law, not the people.The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus "...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds ofvariously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1497 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined:
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Schoolyard bullying in those days was good for a trip to the principal's office, and maybe detention for a few afternoons. No, it's actually a felony to gather a mob to attack someone with a pair of scissors because you think he's gay. It's not a "schoolyard prank", it was an act of gaybashing that apparently had a long-term effect on everyone but the sociopath who instigated it.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Schoolyard bullying in those days was good for a trip to the principal's office, and maybe detention for a few afternoons. Pot and cocaine use were then, and still are, mentioned disparagingly in many a statute book. So is assault.
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Rahvin Member Posts: 4046 Joined: Member Rating: 8.3 |
So is assault. ...with a deadly weapon. Scissors stab and cut, after all. And interfering with the access of a member of a protected class (even if he's only perceived to be gay, he doesn't actually have to be homosexual) to a school (through extreme intimidation and assault on the premises) on the basis of membership in that protected class (attacking a gay guy for being gay) would qualify as a hate crime, nowadays.The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus "...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds ofvariously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.
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Blue Jay Member (Idle past 2728 days) Posts: 2843 From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts Joined:
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Hi, Rahvin.
Rahvin writes: ...with a deadly weapon. Scissors stab and cut, after all. Honestly, tacking on "with a deadly weapon" kind of comes off as an attempt at sensationalism. What he did was bad enough already: there's no need to try to make it sound like attempted murder or something.-Bluejay (a.k.a. Mantis, Thylacosmilus) Darwin loves you.
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subbie Member (Idle past 1285 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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Honestly, tacking on "with a deadly weapon" kind of comes off as an attempt at sensationalism. What he did was bad enough already: there's no need to try to make it sound like attempted murder or something. Perhaps. But at the same time, I guarantee you that there are prosecutors who would not hesitate to file just that kind of charge in exactly that situation (not against someone with Mittens's kind of money, of course). I've seen prosecutors try to enhance a charge for use of a deadly weapon when the "weapon" was a roll of duct tape. And, if the history of the assailant includes threats of violence against the victim before the scissors incident, I might even be inclined to think that a felony charge would be warranted. We have heard that Mittens engaged in some kind of harassing behavior before the scissors incident. Edited by subbie, : SubtitleRidicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Hi Blue Jay
Honestly, tacking on "with a deadly weapon" kind of comes off as an attempt at sensationalism. What he did was bad enough already: there's no need to try to make it sound like attempted murder or something. If he had used a knife to cut the hair would it be different? Remember that intimidation is a part of bullying. But I agree that murder was not part of the intent -- injury was, whether physical or mental is irrelevant. Enjoy.by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Blue Jay Member (Idle past 2728 days) Posts: 2843 From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts Joined:
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Hi, Subbie.
subbie writes: But at the same time, I guarantee you that there are prosecutors who would not hesitate to file just that kind of charge in exactly that situation (not against someone with Mittens's kind of money, of course). For sure: it meets the technical, legal definition well enough, and of course any prosecutor should try for the highest charge possible. But, that's not a good strategy in a debate when you know the opposition isn't going to negotiate with you for a lesser charge. "Enhancing the charge," in this case, is only going to polarize the debate more and make the good argument (that Mitt Romney showed poor character in bullying and in not owning up to it) get lost in exaggerations.-Bluejay (a.k.a. Mantis, Thylacosmilus) Darwin loves you.
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Rahvin Member Posts: 4046 Joined: Member Rating: 8.3
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Honestly, tacking on "with a deadly weapon" kind of comes off as an attempt at sensationalism. Yet it's what he actually did. He assaulted a person, not simply with his fists, but with a deadly weapon.
What he did was bad enough already: there's no need to try to make it sound like attempted murder or something. Thats not the intent at all - there is, in fact, a charge called "attempted murder." If the intent was to make it sound liek Romney tried to kill someone, I would have suggested that actual charge. Assault with a Deadly Weapon does not require intent to kill. If I shoot you with a gun in the leg, intentionally to wound, I have still assaulted you with a deadly weapon. If I stab you in the hand with a knife with the intent only to wound you, I have assaulted you with a deadly weapon. Romney committed an assault, and he used a deadly weapon in the commission of that assault. It's not "charging up," it's what actually happened. It's the real, appropriate charge, as well as the sentence increase that comes with the assault being a hate crime.The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus "...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds ofvariously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.
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Jon Inactive Member
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A voter is allowed to take into consideration any actions of the candidates.
If Coyote doesn't want to take into consideration a hate-crime assault with a deadly weapon, then he sure doesn't have to. But that don't mean the rest of us will also ignore it.Love your enemies! |
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Evlreala Member (Idle past 3106 days) Posts: 88 From: Portland, OR United States of America Joined:
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I just thought it prudent to point out a few things to no one person in particular...
At age 17, neural activity is fundimentally different then it is a decade later. Neural pathway development, hormonal levels, fundimental brain chemestry, even the location of common activity is different. In terms of how he thought as a 17 y/o verses how he thinks presant day, neurologicly, these are two distinctly different people. In fact, the brain isnt even fully developed into an adult brain by 17. Of course, that is not to say that actions at this age or earlier should be completely disregarded, they are often times indicaters of behavior patters, neurosis, psychosis, and/or developmental issues. But neither are they absolutes. In my youth, I percieved a threat from a classmate of mine (a friend at the time). I thought he was going to punch me in the arm, so I lunged at him and drove a pencil into his left eye, broke it off, and thought nothing of it. (They saved his eye and he fully recovered.) I am not the same person I once was. My argument of personal incredulity...
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