Importance of Original Sin

*yawn*Another day, another tired scare tactic clich from a zealot. Guess I won't be hearing your answer about god allowing satan to enter the garden of eden. Oh well. That's too bad. I was looking forward to how that would be spun.

I don't see how you intend to relate this to the point of Matthew 25:31-46.Huh?The exhortation of Christ is that people not be deceived by false prophets in the end times.1.) The exhortation implies some will HEED and some will NOT. Right?2.) So some will be deceived by false prophets in the end times.I don't grasp what your point was in this. And from the standpoint of an Atheist it is even more peculiar that you should care.So let's say you do care and are concerned about false prophets in the last days. Good. Are you implying that I am a false prophet ?I was giving my opinion about what is happening in Europe and in the US in terms of hostility against Christian theists. That was not a "Thus Saith the Lord" type of prophecy.Jesus may not have His second coming for another century. But I doubt it. So I'm not sure what your point was in mentioning false prophets in chapter 24.

The feeling is mutual. No you weren't. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Keep in mind that at the time Jesus spoke these words, His first coming had not yet occurred. Progressive revelation is necessary to fully understand scripture. Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

That's why Jesus facepalmed you for insinuating it. We're not on a team, we're replying independently. And I'm hardly a skeptic.Its just that you post such low hanging fruit... Well, you can either not reply to all of them. Or you can stop spending so much time preaching and stay on point.You asked earlier how you're contradicting the Bible. In Message 623, you wrote:

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Neither the sheep people or the goat people knew Jesus.

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Of course being now found before the Son of Man on the throne of His glory with His angles and his overcomers, they have no choice but to recognize Him as the Lord.

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Both groups say ie. "WHEN ... did we do or not do the things You speak of ? "

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Now some people are very eager to point out that Jesus will rebuke hypocrisy. I think this is not the best passage to show that.

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These Gentiles or nations are ignorant concerning the Lord Jesus. He shows them that He was on the earth as His people who were persecuted during the tribulation.

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If you look at the passages in question, the goats say:

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Matt 25:44 They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

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They were all: "What, we helped you, when didn't we help you?"Since they were under the impression that they had helped Jesus, then they must have known him.

Amen to that!And no pun intended. Well, maybe a little....

I'm trying to pull you back to the points you're ignoring. But we didn't see any rapture. "This generation" passed and many more generations passed and still we have seen no rapture. Either Jesus was wrong or your interpretation is wrong. And there's nothing in the passage to suggest that the brothers of Christ are anything but the other sons of man. You keep expressing your contrary opinion but you don't have anything to back it up.

Simple. You claim that Matthew 25 is a prophecy of the "second coming". In the previous chapter (the same speech) He said that false prophets would talk about the "second coming". He also said that the events that He was talking about would be seen by "this generation". He was clearly talking about current events, not future events. Anybody who twists His words into a prophecy is a false prophet. Yes - but the goats thought they were heeding when in fact they were not. You are claiming a prophecy that either failed or was not a prophecy at all. You're talking about what "is" happening as if it was a fulfillment of the "prophecy" but Jesus said that nobody knows the day except God. Claiming that the "end times" are near is exactly what Jesus was condemning in Matthew 24.

You're the one who seems to be skeptical of what the Bible actually says. You seem to prefer your own opinions.

I am surprised how no one has anything really new in way of objection to my points on Matthew 25:31-46.There is not a single complaint here in the last six posts that I cannot answer or have not already answered. Not one is a unsolvable problem. And for people like ringo, correction does no good. Catholic Scientist imagines that he's on a roll. Ringo dusts off old refuted points and re-packages them.But I think 43 pages of this topic is about enough. Phat, is there a post point in the last few that you would like me to address ? If you, Phat, feel some important point lately has been not responded to as far as I am concerned, let me know.

Well yes, you never answered why the idea of being punished for a sin you didn't commit - original sin - is fair and moral.

Well duh. Its really easy to twist scripture to fit your purpose. You can almost make say whatever you want it to say.There's nothing to be proud of there.You should take it for what it actually says, not invent meaning for it that you like.I thought you were some sort of literalist, rather than a figurativist. *shrugs*But our arguments are about how the meaning that you are inserting into the passages doesn't really fit. We're not questioning your ability to make them up, we're saying that they don't really work. Those arguments, have been left unaddressed. Instead, you just keeping showing off how creative you are.

Or why God allowed Satan to enter the Garden of Eden in the first place.

You haven't "refuted" anything. You've presented your opinion which directly contradicts scripture.

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Matthew 24:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

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The goats thought they were ministering unto Jesus. How could they be anything but Christians?

Verses 41 - 45 does not talk about what they thought they were doing. They talk about what they DID NOT do:

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"For I was hungry and you DID NOT give Me anything to eat. (v.42)
I was thirsty and you DID NOT give Me a drink. (v.42)
I was a stranger and you DID NOT take Me in; (v.43)
naked and you DID NOT clothe Me; (v.43)
sick and in prison, and you DID NOT visit Me. (v.43)"

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The emphasis is on what they DID NOT do.
In your eagerness to condemn Christians you are imagining that Christ is saying "the goats thought they were ministering unto Jesus".
That is absurd.Then the conclusion:

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"Then they also will answer, saying, Lord when have we seen You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to You? (v.44)

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Then He will answer them, saying, Truly I say to you, Inasmuch as you DID NOT do it to one of the least of these, neither have you done it to Me." (v.45)

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They are condemned not for MISTAKEN action but for INACTION.You are trying to twist the meaning around to score a slander on disciples of Jesus, saying that they thought they were ministering unto Jesus. There is no indication that they did ANY ministering whatsoever.Ministering is what they "DID NOT" do.
They may have seen, but they did not minister.Nothing in the passage says that they were ministering anything or THOUGHT they were ministering.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.