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Author Topic:   14C Calibration and Correlations
Tempe 12ft Chicken
Member (Idle past 454 days)
Posts: 438
From: Tempe, Az.
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 43 of 59 (690458)
02-13-2013 10:29 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by CoolBeans
02-13-2013 10:18 AM


Re: Bump for CoolBeans
CoolBeans writes:

The discovery of collagen in a Tyrannosaurus-Rex dinosaur femur bone was recently reported in the journal SCIENCE. This is an outstanding find because collagen being a soft tissue present in most animals is supposed to decay in a few thousand years. Collagen is the main protein found in connective tissue of animals. It can make up as much as 1 to 6 percent of muscle mass. Recently Triceratops and Hadrosaur femur bones in excellent condition were discovered in Glendive Montana and our group received permission to saw them in half and collect samples for Carbon 14 testing. Both bones were tested by a licensed lab for presence of collagen. Both bones did in fact contain some collagen! The best process ( Accelerator Mass Spectrometry ) was used. Total organic carbon and dinosaur bio-apatite was then extracted and pretreated to remove potential contaminants and concordant radiocarbon dates were obtained, all of which were similar to radiocarbon dates for ice age megafauna such as Siberian mammoths, saber tooth tigers of the Los Angeles LaBrea Tarpits, sloth dung and giant bison. We generally go with AMS dating because of its inherent superior accuracy but use the conventional method when large samples are available to completely rule out contamination. This is recommended by the professional carbon dating laboratory specialists.

This is an example of a PRATT, or Point Refuted A Thousand Times. This argument has been bandied about on this site for many years and explanations have already been put forth. If the instance you are speaking of is the T-Rex discovered by Mary Schweitzer than you are missing the portion that these fibers had been fossilized. The fibrous tissue had been rehydrated during the process that removes minerals from bone...

Source

Another thought that is being talked about is that it is because of the structure of collagen that the tendrils in the innermost part can escape fossilization for millions of years. Collagen is comprised of many different tendrils all bundled together, similar to a braided rope with thousands of braids. This could allow for the innermost braids of collagen to avoid the fossilization process. And of the 11 strands of collagen tested from a fossil it was determined that all of the strands came from the innermost portion of the larger braid.

Source

ABE - I also forgot to ask, why were they searching for atmospheric carbon in a fossibl well beyond the range of the test.

Carbon testing of 10,000 year old bone = 10,000
Carbon testing of a 30,000 year old bone = 30,000
Carbon testing of a 50,000 year old bone = 50,000
Carbon testing of a 100,000 year old bone = 50,000

and

Carbon testing of fossil dinosaur millions of years old = 50,000...
...
...
You can't keep counting up past the length of your ruler. And the ruler for Carbon-14 stops at 50,000.

Edited by Tempe 12ft Chicken, : No reason given.


The theory of evolution by cumulative natural selection is the only theory we know of that is in principle capable of explaining the existence of organized complexity. - Richard Dawkins

Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. - Issac Asimov

If you removed all the arteries, veins, & capillaries from a person’s body, and tied them end-to-end…the person will die. - Neil Degrasse Tyson

What would Buddha do? Nothing! What does the Buddhist terrorist do? Goes into the middle of the street, takes the gas, *pfft*, Self-Barbecue. The Christian and the Muslim on either side are yelling, "What the Fuck are you doing?" The Buddhist says, "Making you deal with your shit. - Robin Williams


This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by CoolBeans, posted 02-13-2013 10:18 AM CoolBeans has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 46 by CoolBeans, posted 02-13-2013 11:55 AM Tempe 12ft Chicken has responded

  
Tempe 12ft Chicken
Member (Idle past 454 days)
Posts: 438
From: Tempe, Az.
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 49 of 59 (690471)
02-13-2013 12:32 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by CoolBeans
02-13-2013 11:55 AM


Re: Bump for CoolBeans
CoolBeans writes:

Well they are yecs.....

I am aware of that from the fact that they are ignoring portions of the research that was done on these fossils and incorrectly using carbon dating. What I was trying to point out is that there is already responses to these "issues" within the scientific literature. And the fact that they are YECs does not change the fact that they are incorrect in their statements.

Question for you would be, why should we trust a group that is proving that they do not know how to utilize carbon dating? This seems like a tell tale sign that they are only looking for the answers that they want..

As Richard Dawkins said in the Something from Nothing Lecture at ASU, "It doesn't matter what helps you get to sleep at night, what matters is what is true."


The theory of evolution by cumulative natural selection is the only theory we know of that is in principle capable of explaining the existence of organized complexity. - Richard Dawkins

Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. - Issac Asimov

If you removed all the arteries, veins, & capillaries from a person’s body, and tied them end-to-end…the person will die. - Neil Degrasse Tyson

What would Buddha do? Nothing! What does the Buddhist terrorist do? Goes into the middle of the street, takes the gas, *pfft*, Self-Barbecue. The Christian and the Muslim on either side are yelling, "What the Fuck are you doing?" The Buddhist says, "Making you deal with your shit. - Robin Williams


This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by CoolBeans, posted 02-13-2013 11:55 AM CoolBeans has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by CoolBeans, posted 02-13-2013 12:52 PM Tempe 12ft Chicken has not yet responded

  
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