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Author Topic:   Wither Greece?
Tangle
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From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 4 of 46 (761786)
07-05-2015 6:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Percy
07-05-2015 5:15 PM


Nobody actually knows what to do or what will happen next. There are no good outcomes.
The only way that Greece can recovery inside several generations is if the majority of the debt is written off. But as a large chunk of it already has been and if more is, then the poorer countries that have underwritten it - mostly Eastern European - will be made poorer and more dominos fall.
The question I would like an answer to s how the money was loaned in the first place.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
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Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 22 of 46 (761971)
07-07-2015 5:21 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by nwr
07-06-2015 2:32 PM


Re: The Euro was a bad idea
That's macro economics 101 and everyone was aware of it at the time, and it was for that specific reason that the UK and several other countries (most of Scandanavia) stayed out of the Euro.
The decision to go for a common currency was grandly political, rather than economic, the main drivers where France and Germany that have an ultimate vision of achieving a federal Europe - they have memories of two catastrophic wars and 'never again' is a big thing for them.
A unified currency was a first step and it seemed to work for quite a long time - and might still. It took fraud and lies from Greece and stupidity and wishful thinking by Eurocrats to let Greece into the group in the first place and a global economic meltdown to break it. They're circumstances that are unlikely to be repeated.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by nwr, posted 07-06-2015 2:32 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 27 of 46 (762039)
07-07-2015 5:28 PM


Someone just said this on the radio
'The simple mistake that was made was to pretend that Greek debt was the same as German debt.'
Yup, nailed it.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 38 of 46 (762593)
07-13-2015 4:45 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Diomedes
07-13-2015 4:43 PM


Re: The Latest Agreement
And the UK is doing better than the lot and isn't in the Euro. Just sayin'.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Diomedes, posted 07-13-2015 4:43 PM Diomedes has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9516
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 46 of 46 (763083)
07-20-2015 2:03 PM
Reply to: Message 45 by Diomedes
07-20-2015 1:55 PM


Re: More from the NYT; The IMF backs out
Diomedes writes:
So while we can lay blame on the ECB and Germany for being too strident, we can also say that the Greek government was woefully ill prepared and borderline incompetent in its execution.
It was incompetence combined with corruption that got them into the mess in the first place.
It's pretty clear now that no-one in the negotiation believes a word they were told by the Greek government nor have any confidence in their capabilities to delievr on their promises/lies.
It's a Grexit by a thousand cuts. Rich Greeks are selling their properties at bargain prices to the Russians and getting out as fast as they can - most took their cash out 2 years ago.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by Diomedes, posted 07-20-2015 1:55 PM Diomedes has not replied

  
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