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Author | Topic: What IS Science And What IS NOT Science? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
buz writes: I'm attempting to show why they should not be expected to debate their kind of research on the basis of folks who believe it took eons to come up with life as it is observed both in the fossil record and live. So come up with your own evidence to support your own assertions.
buz writes: I say PaulK and others are not factoring in our hypothesis that there was as ww flood which skews any form of modern dating technique. Again, show us some evidence to support this.
buz writes: Ours factors in a supreme designer intelligently guiding prosesses. Based on what evidence? It's really very simple, Buzsaw. Show us the raw data that clearly indicates your hypothesis and then you'll be "doing science".
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Iano writes: But if science gives only tentitive knowledge about things (for we do not know what we do not yet know) how can it know that it is the prime. Can you defy gravity if you jump off a building? We have observed that no massive body can do such a thing without sufficient means of suspension, but is it the truth? Care to test this "tentitive knowledge"? It matters not what you think we "know". Science is based on what is seen around us. End of story. Edited by RickJB, : No reason given. Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Iano writes: Give me the Bible anyday Oh really? So tell me what does the Bible say about manned flight and aerodynamics, medcine, engineering, chemistry, electronics, astromony etc? Science based on observation and experiment can do all of these things. Your beliefs can't. It's as simple as that. Like many folk of faith you seem utterly oblivious to the extent to which science surrounds you and shapes your world.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
You didn't answer the real thrust of the question, Iano.
What does the Bible have to say about science and technology? Almost nothing. Empirical science clearly works, no matter what your personal beliefs are. Money talks, bullshit walks...
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Iano writes: You seem to me to be trying to establish "tentitiveness within boundaries". However "there are no boundaries that cannot be usurped by further knowledge" - according to the people who say that any and all beliefs must remain open to being cast aside. They should take their own advice. Not at all. I fully accept that what is currently known will be improved/discarded by further knowledge.
Do have the humility to project forward 500 years (assuming we last that long) and suppose people smiling at some of the conclusions some folk take today as nigh-on fact. Some of the conclusions for sure. Not all. My point is that the only way we will gain futher knowledge is from further empirical/experimental investigation. The Bible offers nothing as an alternative. Nothing. Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Iano writes: ToE thrown out? Possible? As a mechanism? Yes, it's possible. But it would have to be replaced by new observations that more successfully explain the evidence of change we see around us, NOT by what is written in the Bible or any other religious text.
Iano writes: [The Bible] tells us some things that happened. How they happened is open to scientific investigation. Scientific investigation shows that they are myths.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Not that science then would be saying anything more definitive than it does today. It's not about what science says, it's about what the evidence shows. Also be aware that scientific knowledge is cumulative. Those fossils aren't just going to magically disappear from the equation. Nor is the atomic behavior of carbon going to change.
Iano writes: Scientific investigation shows that they are myths. I don't see the word 'tentitive' in there anywhere. Why is this? Call it tentative if you insist. However, there is currently no physical evidence to support YEC and the evidence we do have directly contradicts it. This is what you really need to worry about.... Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
nj writes: If you haven't noticed, there has been a slow, but growing scientific exodus over the past 20 years. Away from evolution? Don't make me laugh. The only exodus away from evolution has come from brain-washed Bible-belters in the mid-west US.
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
nj writes: Your Wikipedia quote of 'theory' was perfectly fine. Evolution is a theory. We are in agreement. Oh dear. I see you are still labouring under the layman's misrepresentation of the term "theory". Haven't you been here long enough to know better? A theory is a hypothesis strongly supported by observation. All science is based on theories. Electromagnetism is a theory. This doesn't stop your computer from working. Gravity is also a theory. So why not jump off a tall building and see how "theoretical" (in your terminology) it actually is....
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RickJB Member (Idle past 5021 days) Posts: 917 From: London, UK Joined: |
Buz writes: Both may be observing the same data, working to falsify their hypothesis in order to work towards forming a theory But both aren't doing this! No ID/YEC "scientist" is prepared to accept ANY data (i.e. all of it) that falsifies their religious hypothesis. At the same time no ID/YEC "scientist" can point to any observations that clearly support their ideas. Furthermore, no ID/YEC "scientist" has proposed any kind of hypothetical model to rival the ToE that stands up to even the most basic scrutiny. Given these simple facts alone one can quickly conclude that ID/YEC proponents are not practicing science. Also, YECs were given the oppurtunity to provide links to ID/YEC research in another thread. No response as yet....
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