Religion is for men

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I am not the kind of person who will get bothered by mysoginistic attitudes, because I accept the idea that most men think more objectively.

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You don't mind "hatered of women"?That's what "misogyny" is, you know.

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It is proven, if you look at statistics, that men do better in IQ tests.

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That is not true.Average IQ scores reflect no gender difference.Women and men tend to do better at different parts of IQ tests, and men show a greater range of scores than women, but those are the only gender differences.

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When IQ test were first used it was to 'prove' non whites were not as smart as whites.

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IQ tests were first developed to identify students who needed help in school, Larni.

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it doesn't bother me, because I am content with the roles which women and men play, different roles, and not overly worried about making the sexes the same.

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The thing is, misogyny and sexism isn't about merely recognizing that men and women are different.Feminism readily recognizes that men and women are different.Misogyny and sexism says that the differences mean that one gender is intrinsicly more important or better than the other. It actively discounts and devalues everything about and concerned with the "less important" gender.It is a caste or class system. It's all about power.You may not be "looking" for a competition, but if you accept sexism and misogyny as normal, you are accepting the notion that your gender is intrinsicly less important and not a good as the male gender.

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Or you have not heard 'thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church'?

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I think you may be misinterpreting this passage, ana.I don't think that Jesus used "Peter" as a slang for "penis" the way we do today.This must be why you think that Jesus meant that only men could be leaders of the Church.

So, just looking for an aknowledgement that you saw that your idea that men score better on IQ tests is not correct, and that average IQ scores show no gender difference.Since you used that error as support for one of your arguments, I think it's important to recognize the correction.

There is no firm basis for saying that men score better on IQ tests.It all depends upon how the subtests of any given IQ test are weighted.If the tests are weighted toward the things that men are usually better at (math and spatial ability), the men will show better.If the tests are weighted toward the things women tend to be better at (memory and verbal proficency), the women will do better.There is much, much more overlap than difference in the mean between the genders.IOW, even if IQ tests consistently showed a 5 point difference between men and women, it still would mean that there are an awful lot of women that score higher than an awful lot of men.A normal range of IQ's is something like 70-130, FYI.Therefore, it is meaningless to claim that men "score better" on IQ tests. Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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There is no scriptural evidence that leadership was given to any woman.

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It's also true that women, at that time, were chattel.

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They do not prove that ALL men score better, but that the average score for men is better.

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No.In the tests where the things men are good at are weigted more heavily, men score better.In the tests where the things that women are better at are weighted more heavily, women score better.It is entirely possible, IOW, to design an IQ test in which it can be predicted that women will score better than men, since you can weight the memory and verbal parts of the test to count more.

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Well, yes, but not to Jesus.

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Really? Says who?He was feminist for the time, but I don't remember him making any sermons or statements declaring the chattel-status of women to be wrong or immoral. He didn't do that for slaves, either.

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Still, He chose men, and the idea is that there is no 'at that time' for a god who is not limited by time.

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OK, so why didn't he choose an astronaut for a first Pope?

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By the same token, men of 'that time' would possibly not have accepted a female leader, but its hard to say. Those gosh darn gentile Romans with their female gods and all.

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Er, I'm not sure why you are now arguing my point, that it had to do with the historical context and social attitudes and rules of the time, but I'll take the concession.

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On a side note, it is a little curious that, for all the hatred spent on the monarchies, the Divine Right of Kings was also, the Divine Right of Queens, and, well, democracy has not made a female president yet.

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It most certainly has, or did you think that the only democracy in the world was the one in the US?There have been at least 40 female presidents.If you want to count prime ministers, there have been at least 39.There are currently at least 9 elected female world leaders right now.Chile, Liberia, Bangladesh, the Phillipines, Germany, Finland, Latvia, New Zealand, and Ireland all have elected heads of state that are women.See, it's the US that is sexist and backward.Edited by nator, : No reason given.Edited by nator, : No reason given.Edited by nator, : No reason given.

At any rate, ana, your couple of justifications for how male-only leadership is somehow "normal" or "natural" have been pretty soundly debunked.

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What I did say was that the male-only priesthood is Biblical and based on the actions of Jesus. It is taught infallibly, and no amount of speculation about who woulda coulda shoulda been anywhere, will change that.

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You also said that you weren't bothered by woman hating attitudes, since men are clearly more suited to lead than women because they score higher on IQ tests.I mean, didn't you mean to say that since you think men are naturally smarter they make better leaders?

Didn't you say: If you didn't mean to say that men aren't naturally smarter, what did you mean?If you didn't mean to say that you weren't bothered by woman-hating attitudes, what did you mean?