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Author Topic:   Dinosaurs living with humans?
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1498 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 90 of 112 (111709)
05-31-2004 2:15 AM
Reply to: Message 89 by Hangdawg13
05-31-2004 1:56 AM


The probabilities of life forming by chance and then evolving are so small that they become impossible even with the allotted billions of years of time.
Oh yeah? Exactly what are the probabilities? Numbers, please, and I'd like to see your math.
How small a probability is "impossible"?
They are refuted by the cambrian explosion
The "explosion" you refer to constitutes a time period several million years long. To put that into perspective, a lot of the plant species you're familiar with day-to-day are significantly younger than that.
lack of intermediary fossils
No such lack. Transitional Vertebrate Fossils FAQ. As you can see, among the species we would expect to fossilize - vertebrates - we find a number of transitional forms.
(such as the human footprints at Glenrose).
This is just a flat-out lie. There's no such footprints.
I once believed in evolution because thats what I was taught in school.
Well, no wonder you're a creationist - you believe things for the wrong reasons.
Around here, you'll find that evolutionists are convinced by evidence, not by authority or pedanticism. Care to provide some evidence?
This is statistically impossible
There's that argument from statistics, again, but you keep forgetting to actually give any statistics. Why is that, exactly?
however I still would like for someone to go to Glenrose and place their feet in the footprints and come back believing they aren't human footprints.
I've seen pictures of the "footprints" you're talking about - the 20" long ones, right? - and I don't see how anybody but an idiot can come to the conclusion that an enormous, misshapen, eroded pit with no visible toeprints, heel depression, or instep is supposed to be a "human footprint."
Unless you're talking about different prints, or something. It'd be nice if you could hit us with pictures.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by Hangdawg13, posted 05-31-2004 1:56 AM Hangdawg13 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Hangdawg13, posted 05-31-2004 2:36 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1498 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 94 of 112 (111963)
06-01-2004 2:33 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Hangdawg13
05-31-2004 2:36 PM


The simplest conceivable form of single-celled life should have at least 600 different protein molecules.
The average male, during orgasm, ejactulates somewhere between 40 and 600 million sperm. Only one of them fertilizes an egg.
The odds that the result of that fertilization would be you, therefore, is something on the order of one in 40 to 600 million. The odds that you exist are, at best, 1 in 40 million.
Are we supposed to conclude that you don't exist, therefore, because the odds are too low that you do? I guess so.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Hangdawg13, posted 05-31-2004 2:36 PM Hangdawg13 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by Hangdawg13, posted 06-01-2004 10:56 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1498 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 106 of 112 (112397)
06-02-2004 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by Hangdawg13
06-01-2004 10:56 PM


Wow is that logic messed up.
Exactly right. Trying to determine probability afer the fact is ridiculous and "messed up." So why did you try to do it? That's what I dont understand. Apparently, you knew your argument was based on a ridiculous premise - obviously, because you recognized the ridiculousness of the same argument turned against you - so why did you offer it in the first place?
The odds that the sperm containing half of MY specific genetic material are 1 in 40 million.
No, it's not.
Meiosis includes "crossover", where elements from complimentary chromosomes are exchanged. That means there's considerable variation among sperm in terms of exactly which genes they have and don't have. The sperm that fertilized your zygote wasn't one of 20 million exact copies. It may very well have had an entirely unique mix of genes.
If the odds of simply getting pregnant were 1 in 40 million
Obviously, they're not. Where did I say that they were? Please, don't put words in my mouth - especially not such stupid ones, ok?
We are talking about the odds of life simply forming at all, not the odds of it having blonde hair, blue eyes, and a devastatingly handsome appearance!
If you didn't have the unique mix of genes that you possess, you wouldn't be you. Since the odds of you possessing that unique mix are so low - one in millions - are we supposed to conclude that you aren't yourself?
Or are we just supposed to conclude - as you so rightly did - that trying to argue from probability after the fact is an exercise in tomfoolery?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by Hangdawg13, posted 06-01-2004 10:56 PM Hangdawg13 has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1498 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 107 of 112 (112398)
06-02-2004 12:18 PM
Reply to: Message 101 by Hangdawg13
06-02-2004 12:06 AM


My argument however was about life forming at all, not what kind of life might form.
If that's true, then why was your argument based on the odds of forming chemicals that are required, as far as we know, only for our kind of life?
You don't seem to be too clear on what you're arguing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 101 by Hangdawg13, posted 06-02-2004 12:06 AM Hangdawg13 has not replied

  
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