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Author Topic:   How does Complexity demonstrate Design
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 217 of 321 (133928)
08-14-2004 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 213 by yxifix
08-14-2004 7:03 PM


Until you're able to express these "proofs" coherently, they don't really prove anything.
I'm sorry but your posts are simply incomprehensible. If you want to argue with us you need to do a much better job of expressing yourself. Until then we literally don't have much of an idea of what you're saying.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 213 by yxifix, posted 08-14-2004 7:03 PM yxifix has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 218 by yxifix, posted 08-14-2004 8:49 PM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 220 of 321 (133934)
08-14-2004 8:55 PM
Reply to: Message 218 by yxifix
08-14-2004 8:49 PM


I don't have to do anything. I have just finished. I showed a proof of the truth.
The sense of which, however, no one can suss out but you. So what have you accomplished? Even if you have the truth and we don't, what does it serve for you to conceal it in nonsense?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 218 by yxifix, posted 08-14-2004 8:49 PM yxifix has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 240 of 321 (134081)
08-15-2004 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 233 by yxifix
08-15-2004 11:45 AM


Pasteur's example did show and prove exactly what is true and what is false.
In what way? Pasteur's experiment proved that fully-formed bacteria don't arise spontaneously from a specific sterile broth over a geologically short time period.
In what way does that specific finding apply to abiogenesis? That's like saying "I can't flap my arms and fly, therefore there's no way to get from New York to London in under 8 hours." In other words you're generalizing too far from one specific experiment.
Pasteur did make his experiment on the whole sample (bacteria - each bacteria has the same way of reproduction, noone can just appears).
But nobody has claimed that bacteria are the simplest possible form of life, or that they're the first common ancestor. Nobody here claims that bacteria were the first product of abiogenesis.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 233 by yxifix, posted 08-15-2004 11:45 AM yxifix has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 241 by yxifix, posted 08-15-2004 1:42 PM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 242 of 321 (134085)
08-15-2004 1:58 PM
Reply to: Message 241 by yxifix
08-15-2004 1:42 PM


Unbelievable... you are still the same... full of demagogy.
Well, the word is "demagoguery", for starters, and that's not an argument that refutes my point, that's just calling me names. Moreover you're calling me the wrong name:
quote:
Demagogue:
1 : a leader who makes use of popular prejudices and false claims and promises in order to gain power
2 : a leader championing the cause of the common people in ancient times
Since I'm not 1, and certainly can't be 2, you've called me a bizzarely inaccurate name.
I wasn't talking about abiogenesis
No, you were. You supplied Pasteur's experiment as an example against abiogenesis.
but I've given an example of a proof and applied it to "accident" and "information - DNA code or cell".
Right, which was improper. Since Pasteur's experiment supports no conclusions about DNA, "accidents", or "information", it's not proper to employ it to support any of your conclusions.
Maybe you don't know how an argument works, but it's where you support your conclusions with non-fallacious reasoning. Your premises fail to support your conclusions, so all you've offered is nearly incomprehensible rhetoric.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by yxifix, posted 08-15-2004 1:42 PM yxifix has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 244 by yxifix, posted 08-15-2004 2:17 PM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 256 of 321 (134301)
08-16-2004 10:38 AM
Reply to: Message 244 by yxifix
08-15-2004 2:17 PM


Is it a proof or not?
A scientific experiment is never proof. Scientific conclusions are always tentative.
So no, it's not proof.
You are typical ignorant.
Which is more name-calling, not an argument.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by yxifix, posted 08-15-2004 2:17 PM yxifix has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by yxifix, posted 08-16-2004 10:49 AM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 258 of 321 (134308)
08-16-2004 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 257 by yxifix
08-16-2004 10:49 AM


And that means you are saying evolution is just your assertion you have no evidence for, nothing more.
No, it's a tentative conclusion supported by a weight of evidence.
Just because scientific conclusions are tenative and not definative doesn't mean they're all assumptions.
In fact, proof is the assumption - you can only have a proof by means of constructing a tautology from assumed axioms. The very reason that there is no proof in science stems from the scientific goal of making the least amount of assumptions.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by yxifix, posted 08-16-2004 10:49 AM yxifix has replied

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 Message 259 by yxifix, posted 08-16-2004 11:06 AM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 262 of 321 (134317)
08-16-2004 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 259 by yxifix
08-16-2004 11:06 AM


You are also using stuff you have never seen to "prove" evolution is correct so clearly
I'm "proving" nothing. I'm simply saying that the scientific consensus is correct - evolution is the most accurate model of the history of life on Earth.
You, on the other hand, are putting words in my mouth that I never said.
So again - according to your words Evolution is just an assertion without evidencese.
You know I didn't say that, Y.
So now it is just a question of belief really
You've done what I told you not to do - conflated tentativity with ignorance.
Just because we don't know everything with 100%, eternal certainty, doesn't mean that everything we know is a belief. Science is tenative. It's not just making things up, like you do.
It's clear that you're unable to comprehend how science works. Maybe you shouldn't be involved in cientific discussions, then?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 259 by yxifix, posted 08-16-2004 11:06 AM yxifix has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 265 by yxifix, posted 08-16-2004 8:08 PM crashfrog has not replied

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