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Author Topic:   Education
Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 277 of 304 (271448)
12-21-2005 1:46 PM
Reply to: Message 276 by NosyNed
12-21-2005 1:20 PM


Re: Evo-Science and Life's Origins?
Evolutionary science couldn't possibly be talking about life's origins since it is, by definition, about living things.
I'm not a good linguist, just hyper-concerned and accountable.
What publishable disclaimer(s), might you propose to keep the N.A.S. and/or 9th grade biology-educators in check. Perhaps, elaborate more on your daughter's. Or, what about your statement:
"Evolutionary science couldn't possibly be talking about life's origins since it is, by definition, about living things."
...seems like an excellent disclaimer to me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by NosyNed, posted 12-21-2005 1:20 PM NosyNed has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 279 by jar, posted 12-21-2005 2:01 PM Philip has not replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 280 of 304 (271464)
12-21-2005 2:31 PM
Reply to: Message 252 by FliesOnly
12-19-2005 2:17 PM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
FliesOnly writes:
. It's nonsensical bull shit rambling like this
... oh fucking PLEASE give us this hypothesis!
... The other stuff you wrote is mostly meaningless garbage
This clams me up FO; now I request a minor apology.
Note: you don't have to concede on anything I say; and I recant in hypocritically *backing you into a corner* out-of-the-blue.
But, your (toned down) persistence is appreciated, in a probationary manner for now, in the hopes of promoting ”good will’, ”truth’, and/or 'appropriate feedback'.
Philip writes:
4) Special creation hypotheses ”fit’ to salvage the currently perverted ToE paradigms of the N.A.S.
FliesOnly writes:
What, exactly, are these "special creation hypotheses"?
Here’s 3 (personally) necessary hypothetical conjectures that seem to me to salvage the currently 'flawed and perverted' ToE paradigms of the N.A.S. ... seeing it already delved too wrecklessly into its preposterous 'origins' propaganda (http://nationalacademies.org/evolution/):
1) God (specially) created Heaven and Earth
2) God (specially) created living entities
3) God (specially) created "psyches"
I'm not advocating to write these hypotheses verbatum in 'an N.A.S. disclaimer'. A collection of judges (without my flawed-linguistic skills) may come up with something.
The point being, I feel dreadfully accountable for 9th graders abused by biologists delving beyond their scope. How far into 'life's origins' do you want them to teach my 9th graders? Really?
Also, consider commenting on NosyNed's controversal suggestions to this problem.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by FliesOnly, posted 12-19-2005 2:17 PM FliesOnly has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by jar, posted 12-21-2005 2:53 PM Philip has replied
 Message 282 by nwr, posted 12-21-2005 2:55 PM Philip has not replied
 Message 283 by FliesOnly, posted 12-21-2005 3:12 PM Philip has replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 284 of 304 (271728)
12-22-2005 1:13 PM
Reply to: Message 283 by FliesOnly
12-21-2005 3:12 PM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
FliesOnly writes:
Philip writes:
How far into 'life's origins' do you want them to teach my 9th graders? Really?
As far as the science can take them. Seems like the prudent thing to do, wouldn't you agree.
Pray tell, how far might that be (no more circling discussion please)?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 283 by FliesOnly, posted 12-21-2005 3:12 PM FliesOnly has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 285 by FliesOnly, posted 12-22-2005 2:47 PM Philip has not replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 286 of 304 (271766)
12-22-2005 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 281 by jar
12-21-2005 2:53 PM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
jar writes:
Philip writes:
1) God (specially) created Heaven and Earth
2) God (specially) created living entities
3) God (specially) created "psyches"
Any such statements would be ... (1) unconstitutional as well as (2) really really bad science.
(1) "Unconstitutional" seems to me like "unbiblical", oft-ammended/interpreted to mean almost anything (by both sides). Yet it seems to have evolved into an excellent "disclaimer" against all *vicars* in the US ...be it Pope, Darwin, Al Qaeda, N.A.S., Philip, or the like.
(2) I concede, it sounds really really bad on science paper. But, the alternative theories of evolution for these 3 *key events* are really really bad flaws, puny scientists delving into infinitely-complex-mysteries; and/or worse yet: "science disproving science"
The greatest flaw continues: science authority misrepresents itself to 9nth graders and (ignorantly) comes across as disproving all *spiritual events* to these children, beginning with these 3 *key* events.
Science academia is most excellent, I agree ... But, we're know-it-alls, puffed-up, defensive, flawed, and clumsy... to various extents.
Should little Sally fully trust everything she reads from Philip, Jar, the N.A.S. and other biology hirelings? They have sin, too. There's plenty of blame to go around.
Who knows? ... Being 'cool' and pre-confessing our sins with public science disclaimers everywhere might actually benefit R&D, discoveries, genetic breakthroughs, etc. ... evoking more excellent science breakthroughs and fewer perverted flaws.
-----------------------------
It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones. (Luk 17:2)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by jar, posted 12-21-2005 2:53 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 287 by FliesOnly, posted 12-22-2005 3:49 PM Philip has not replied
 Message 288 by jar, posted 12-22-2005 4:33 PM Philip has not replied
 Message 289 by Theodoric, posted 12-22-2005 5:00 PM Philip has replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 296 of 304 (278105)
01-11-2006 11:16 AM
Reply to: Message 289 by Theodoric
12-22-2005 5:00 PM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
Theodoric writes:
If you want... some sort of disclaimers, prove that they are scientific and not religiously based.
This is utter trash and nonsense!
A disclaimer against false science in classrooms is humanistic and legalistic (i.e., to protect against freaky science)
(Disclaimers need not be religious nor scientific): E.g.:
"Don't believe everything you read"
"Theories are not always fact"
"Scientific flaws and gaps abound in the following material ..."
...etc.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 289 by Theodoric, posted 12-22-2005 5:00 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 297 by crashfrog, posted 01-11-2006 11:28 AM Philip has replied
 Message 298 by mark24, posted 01-11-2006 1:53 PM Philip has replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 299 of 304 (278266)
01-11-2006 6:10 PM
Reply to: Message 297 by crashfrog
01-11-2006 11:28 AM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
"Theories are never facts. Theories are explanitory models developed to explain facts."
Good point concerning scientific fact(s) (if there be such a thing).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by crashfrog, posted 01-11-2006 11:28 AM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by crashfrog, posted 01-12-2006 11:45 AM Philip has not replied

Philip
Member (Idle past 4752 days)
Posts: 656
From: Albertville, AL, USA
Joined: 03-10-2002


Message 300 of 304 (278282)
01-11-2006 6:48 PM
Reply to: Message 298 by mark24
01-11-2006 1:53 PM


Re: N.A.S. Evo-Knowledge vs. My Cat's
Now how can perfectly valid science offend religion or perfectly valid religion offend science?
The disclaimer is against assumptions of science as being perfectly valid.
Because the current mega-ToE is not perfectly valid and is, moreover, seriously flawed and fluked; it must be disclaimed as flawed and such.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 298 by mark24, posted 01-11-2006 1:53 PM mark24 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 301 by mark24, posted 01-11-2006 6:50 PM Philip has not replied

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