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Author Topic:   Both or neither.
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 134 (55540)
09-15-2003 2:46 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by sconzey
09-15-2003 2:22 PM


quote:
The general dehumanisation and evilness that has come from evolutionary teaching. (Points at aborigonies, blacks, etc.)
I'd strongly reccomend clarifying this statement. As it stands, it comes off horribly bigoted.
quote:
Yes, I remember the crusades too, but I feel these are not relavent because the crusades were not really related to *creation* but Christianity.
Is creation a part of Christianity or not?
quote:
Irreducible complexity.
I think it's Crashfrog who has a really good refutation of this idea. I'll let him handle it.
quote:
The general damn improbableness of it all...
What are you basing this statement on? Let's define terms before debating them.
quote:
from what I gather the main problem people have with creation is the idea that they are accountable to a greater being.
You gather wrong. There are plenty of people who deny a literal interpretation of genesis, and still believe in God. So they hold themselves accountable to a greater being, and still don't believe in creation.
Secondly, you're using circular logic here. The validity of creation is what would show the existence of God, right? So saying that someone doesn't believe in creation because they don't want to believe in God is backwards.
When people don't believe in God, it's because we don't see any validity to the supporting ideas. Not vice versa.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by sconzey, posted 09-15-2003 2:22 PM sconzey has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 134 (55550)
09-15-2003 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by sconzey
09-15-2003 3:49 PM


quote:
Okay... I am talking about the fact that certain races were abused and experimented on due to the belief that they were lesser evolved sub-humans... Aboriginies, Native Americans, Blacks... Correct me if I am mistaken.
Okay. It's good you clarified, because it sounded like you were saying that black people were evil.
Now let's clarify further. What example can you give us of someone teaching evolution, and this teaching leading directly to inhuman experimentation?
Keep in mind: we teach that a thing called a gun exists. But it can hardly be said that this directly leads to school shootings. Similarly, people are taught Christianity, but this doesn't directly lead to blowing up a gay bar.
quote:
Creation is part of Christianity, but Creation is also part of many other religions...
Can we clarify again, then... are you requesting that we teach that Chronos the Titan mated with Gaea to produce the heavens and the Earth? Or is it a Christian-specific creation you're looking to have taught?
If it's Christian-specific, then Christianity itself is fair game.
quote:
I would love to hear crashfrogs refutation.
If I remember right, it involves a stone arch. The kind where the removal of any one stone would result in the entire arch collapsing. One would look at it and think, "That couldn't possibly have been built stone-by-stone." But it was.
quote:
Right, the chimp argument. For those of you not familliar one famous evolutionist who's name I forget (remind me), said that the victory of chance would be proven by the fact that a load of apes, in a room of computers would eventually produce the complete works of shakespeare or, I think it was the Lord's Prayer.
Okay, lets do some maths, first one chimp... We start with the assumption that they press one key per second... there are 116 keys on my keyboard... So that means they have a 1/116 chance of pressing the 'correct key'
The probability of pressing the 'right' keys twice in a row will be 1/116*1/116 = 7.43163e-5 or 0.0000743163.
Thats two letters.
Pressing one key per second, that gives us 13456 seconds, (1/0.0000743163), or 224.267 minutes, or just under 4 hours.
Right, the first two words of The Lord's Prayer are 'Our Father (who art in heaven hallowed be thy name yada yada yada)'
Thats ten letters ignoring case. If you had sticky keys, then it would be twelve with the correct case.
That gives us (1/116)^12 = 1.68463e-25 or 0.0000000000000000000000000168463
And what would the chances be of producing the phrase: "Xe1 eR$$sup"? Exactly the same.
So? Are you saying that a failure of randomness is also improbable to the point of impossibility? That a monkey could not possibly type out a phrase like "Ris*e #eal"? The chances are the same as typing out "Our Father".
quote:
And yes, my last comment on my previous post was circular reasoning, I withdraw it.
I see this so rarely on message boards, it always makes me smile when I do. You, sir, are a gentleman.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by sconzey, posted 09-15-2003 3:49 PM sconzey has not replied

  
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