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Author Topic:   Glenn Morton hypothesis: The Flood could ONLY have happened 5 million+ years ago
Equinox
Member (Idle past 5170 days)
Posts: 329
From: Michigan
Joined: 08-18-2006


Message 85 of 130 (392336)
03-30-2007 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 78 by mpb1
03-29-2007 10:16 PM


Re: Note
I think that we all need to acknowledge something here, though I’m sure many of us already recognize it - and that is the fact that Glen Morton’s idea of a local flood 5 million years ago has at least a tenuous grasp on reality, and actually uses evidence for support. Sure, we can discuss the comparison between this 5 million, Local flood (I’ll call it 5L), as compared to the idea that the Genesis story is simply a fabrication with no basis in reality - in which case 5L may not clearly win.
But that’s very different from comparing 5L to the idea that a flood occurred literally as described in Genesis, after the rise of, say, language or such. In that case, 5L is clearly and irrefutably superior, and posts like this:
mpb1 wrote:
..... I also believe God could have performed any kind of miracle necessary to accomplish his purposes.
If Christians are willing to accept the other miracles of the Bible - some of which also involved water - it isn't a great stretch to believe He could have caused water to run uphill if He chose to do so.
In this thread, my argument was against anyone claiming that origin theories MUST be pushed back in history prior to five million years ago because of the Flood. That's it.
Show that this very question is often considered. Maybe we should be clear about which question we are discussing, since they have very different outcomes wrt 5L. Or start a thread that states which is being discussed?
Have a fun day-

-Equinox
_ _ _ ___ _ _ _
You know, it's probably already answered at An Index to Creationist Claims...
(Equinox is a Naturalistic Pagan -  Naturalistic Paganism Home)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by mpb1, posted 03-29-2007 10:16 PM mpb1 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 98 by grmorton, posted 04-01-2007 11:56 AM Equinox has replied

  
Equinox
Member (Idle past 5170 days)
Posts: 329
From: Michigan
Joined: 08-18-2006


Message 120 of 130 (392832)
04-02-2007 2:46 PM
Reply to: Message 98 by grmorton
04-01-2007 11:56 AM


Re: Note
But if we think there would be observational evidence resulting from such a flood, then we can't call upon miracle everytime observation fails to support our view of how the flood happens. To do that is to make up miracles for God to perform in the past in order to support our strange ideas in the present. In other words, to make God perform miracles when we lack observational support for our pet flood theory, we are in effect making God dance to our tune.
Making God do our bidding is a bad thing.
Right.
Yes. Along those same lines, I’ve been thinking for a while (when my life calms down in about a month) of writing a short essay and probably starting a thread here asking why Creationists bother. Specifically, with all the supernatural things already admittedly in the story (Such as the YEC’s saying that Noah got divine blueprints & a divine weather forecast, that the animals came at God’s call, that the weather/atmosphere was controlled by God to do his immediate bidding, etc . .), then why do creationist bother to try to cook up physical evidence where there is none? Why not attribute it all - including the present lack of evidence, to a divine miracle? Why bother with all the lying and mental contortionism when the YEC’s have already resorted to the miracle card elsewhere in the story? Perhaps because doing so means that physical measurement of anything then becomes irrelevant, since, as you mentioned, we are making miracles for any observation we don't like, and then science is tossed out the window.
Thanks for your reply. It looks like good stuff for a future thread.
Also, mpb1 - I checked out your website - good stuff. I’ve told many creationists that creationism is the single biggest threat to Christianity, and that it hurts Christianity more than it hurts science education. Maybe, as a fellow Christian, you’ll get more traction with them than I did.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by grmorton, posted 04-01-2007 11:56 AM grmorton has not replied

  
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