Can Domestic Selection cause Macroevolution?

Can we equate macroevolution with speciation?If so and considering ring species as seperate species, couldn't we also consider a chihuahua and a great dane as seperate species and say that domestic breeding HAS lead to macroevolution. I type this becuase, it is my understanding that ring species are not genetically incompatible, they just do not interbreed because of their morphological differences, the same reason that a chihuahua and a great dane do not interbreed.So, can we say that DS has lead to macroevolution?I may be wrong, I'm asking.

I agree. Like I said, it depends...It depends on what you mean by macroevolution and where you draw the species line. But, in the context of convincing a YEC that DS has lead to macroevolution, or anything for that matter, I don't think this will work. I thought it was a good idea, i mean, you can look at it that way if you want too. It is just too hard to say exactly when the speciation has occured when looking at it within our extremely small time scale.

Perhaps it will been seen there first. NS takes SOOOOO long to yield macroevolution, that even when sped up via DS, we are still gonna have to wait a while before we observe it. I think we might be getting close with dogs though. What if we found two breeds of dogs that were genetically incompatible? They'd be different species and perhaps an observation of macroevolution, no?

It means they can't reproduce because of their genetic differences.A human and a chimp can mate but they cannot reproduce because of genetic difference. They are sepreate species. Some animals of the same species cannot reproduce, not becase of genetic differences, but because of morphological differences. When these differences leads to genetic incompatibility, a new species has emerged and macroevolution has occured. Well, its only a problem for the YEC and if you are going to refuse to accept persuasion then you will always be a YEC. So we can make progress. If we were all YECs that refused persuasion we would still be in the dark ages. We would hault scientific progress and that is something I am willing to fight against.

But the breeds are still the same species. What do you call it when you breed enough until the different breeds can no longer reproduce? What do you call it when after many centuries, they are no longer two breeds, but two species?You call it macroevolution. To equate macroevolution with breeding is inaccurate.

But differet species of dogs.

quote:

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ploy: An action calculated to frustrate an opponent or gain an advantage indirectly or deviously; a maneuver

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You're rude. That wasn't a ploy it was an honest definition. This sugests that they desend from a common ancestor that through NS has developed into different breeds which eventually became genetically incompatible and continued to evolve into the species that we see. A great example of macroevolution. What we see in dogs today is the step of different breeds and given enough time (and genetic seperation) those breeds could develop into different species of dogs, just like the cats did. And that is why the YECs cannot make progress because that is exactly what they do.

Yes, that's another definitional ploy. All words. Nothing substantive. You just gave a great example of it occuring in the cats. you sure are rude.

But the thing is, when we study whether or not things evolve and find that the old definitions are inaccurate and don't work, we come up with new definitions that do work so progress can be made. Its honest and beneficial. Its not a ploy, don't be so paranoid.

I don't know if its latin but otherwise thats exactly what 'species' is.