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Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
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Author | Topic: Terry at the Talk Origins board | |||||||||||||||||||
roxrkool Member (Idle past 1017 days) Posts: 1497 From: Nevada Joined: |
Hmmmmmm..... clamps (in an oven) = lithostatic pressure??
Sorry about the trolling, but I was a bit surprised by the comparison. Not to mention his last statement.
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
From this topic.
The Great Society (message 60):
quote: Terry replys (message 61);
quote: And then Salty says (message 62):
quote: Those are the three messages in their entirety. Moose
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1495 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
It would seem that the teaching of evolution exclusively violates the provisions of the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution since the Government is not supposed to legislate either for or against any particular religion. Clearly that's an erroneous interpretation of First Amendment law. For instance, the various Defense of Marriage Acts or the prohibition against bigamy represent official government sanction of "religious" ideas. So religious thought can't be specifically prohibited from being considered as law, I guess.
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
"Morton's Demon" has come up in another topic. I believe I also touched upon it upstring (but I haven't checked).
Anyhow, I made "Morton's Demon" a topic at Terry's Talk Origins. Terry took great offense. The end of that topic is here. Navigate back, to see the earlier pages. (That site is structured clumsy - It always gives you a full last page - All the page structures changes as messages are added - You can't seem to be able to link to a full page 1 and then work your way down string.) Moose
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
What might be an interesting topic to observe.
Here at Terry's Talk Origins. I believe this link will take you to the most recent page of the topic. Currently there is only one page. A strong rebutal (message 2) came from someone who does not seem to be on the evolution side. I also like his comments on communism, Reagan, and G.W. Bush in message 4 (which was a response to a Salty interjection at message 3) Moose Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment. "Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham |
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
Not a "Terry's Talk Origins" related message, but something concerning the spin-off forum "Fringe Science".
At the Age of the Earth topic (which has drift all over the place) I am attempting to discuss very basic geology with someone going by the name of SaltbeGood. SbG seems to be locked into near total ignorance of geology, but that isn't stopping him/her. Anyhow, SbG's posting style is starting to remind me of someone who once posted here at . SbG also seems to be fairly good with HTML. Any guesses on what other name SbG might have gone under? Moose
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
I have come to think that SaltbeGood=Whatever.
Moose
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
I think not. whatever never even learned how to do paragraphs or punctuation. LOL
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
Submitted for your potential amusement:
I've recently started the John A. Davison and Terry agree only that "Darwinism" is wrong topic at Terry's Talk Origins. Essentially, this is a parallal thread to the Who to believe , Ham or Ross? topic. In that context, John A. Davison is (more or less) a "Rossite" while Terry is a "Hamite". Despite the gulf between, they refuse to debate their relative positions. It's currently at message 5. I have hopes that "The Great Society" will chip in soon. I'm keeping copies of the topic messages, to guard against deletions. So far, JAD has trotted out the "Darwinian mystics" phrase, and Terry has vaguely likened "Darwinism" to "vodooism". I have vaguely turned the "voodoism" phrase back against him. We shall see if this topic gets me banned there. Moose Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment. "Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1495 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
If I might cheerlead, I suggest turning Terry's phrase about drowning men clutching at straws back on him, as that's pretty much the perfect phrase to describe his support for JAD's cockamamie nonsense.
Man what a confederacy of dunces you have over there. How do you put up with it?
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
It is not so much that Terry supports JAD's position, but that Terry finds supporting JAD's position to somehow be a support to his own position. After all, I believe JAD still considers himself to be a (non-Darwinian) old Earth evolutionist.
JAD neither supports or contests Terry's position. Like I said there, they operate purely on the "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" line of reasoning. I pay attention to the topics I started. I lightly follow a few others. I ignore most of the topics. If it weren't for "The Great Society", I would pobably find that site be worthless. I wonder if "TGS" lurks somewhere here at . Moose {Edited to change ID} This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 04-05-2005 10:07 PM
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wj Inactive Member |
Necessity makes strange bedfellows.
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Brad McFall Member (Idle past 5061 days) Posts: 3428 From: Ithaca,NY, USA Joined: |
Terry ended that Moose's Url with,
quote: It was nice to see some truth revealed caused perhaps in part by your interdigitation between the two because JAD said,
quote: and so I could easily ADD Georgi Gladyshev to make a trio about of that dynamic duo as he GG has discussed especially on the social level of macrothermodyanics "divide and conquer". I had dismissed it as politics at first but now I am getting a second thought/read thanks to your attempt at comparision to Ham and Ross. I know Ross is wrong. Ham I actually spoke with. What is CRITICALLY important was where John Davison said,
quote: This is what Popper said in 72 and Dr. Gladyshev is not remiss to recall this Sir.(from Objective Knowledge/Of Clouds and Clocks p225) "For if we accept a theory of evolution (such as Darwin's) then even if we remain skeptical about the theory that life emerged from inorganic matter we can hardly deny that there must have been a time when abstract and non-physical entites, such as reasons and arguments and scientific knowledge, and abstract rules, such as rules for building railwayss or bulldozers or sputniks or , say, rules of grammer or of counterpoint, did not exist, or at any rate had no effect upon the physical universe. It is difficult to understand how the physical universe could produce abstract entites such as rules, and then could come under the influence of these rules, so that these rules in their turn could exert very palpable effects upon the physical universe. There is, however, at least one perhaps somewhat evasive but at any rate easy way out of this difficulty...that the existence of anything non-physical is just 'an illusion', perhaps, at any rate unimportant, since everything would go on as it does even if there were no such illusions." I dont think that this is the case anymore today. This IS somewhat mystical it seems to me as THE WAY out. Heirarchical thermodyanmics can remove possibly for sure Popper's intial "skepticism" but we still have to deal with the DELUSION as Georgi has associated with Boltzmann FROM the illusion and there probably is some "plan" involvable, regardless I think I KNOW what it was that is preventing the body science from recognizing the "Created Species referred to polyphyletically" here. It might be noted that some continental biologists accused Croizat of operating with polyphyletic groups. I think the error came from Nelson and Platnick's assesment of Lyell for as JAD said, we have much to learn about time. Perhaps now would be the time to also analyze Gould's concept of diversity. N&P had in Systematics and Biogeography/Space/Biogeographic History -
Lyell accepted the reality of Candolle's regions, but believed that, to some extent at least, they were capable of causal explanation with the facts then on hand. He theorized that the number of living species is in equilibrium. He believed that some species had suffered extinction in the past and that, therefore, there should be a creative principle responsible for the emergence of new species, such that the equilibrium could be maintained. New species, he imagined, were created one at a time, in one region or another. Lyell's concept o f"creation" is not micraculous creation, but creation according to natural law and process. he was not specific about the nature of creative laws and processm but he did argue against the idea, as expounded by Buffon and Lamark in particular, that the process involved evolution - or transmutation, as it was then called - of species." It is probably not coincidence that in the continued discussion of teleology Mayr changed his wording from "system" to "process". continuing with N&Ppage394-5
One of the more remarkable items in the pre-Darwinian period is a paper by Alfred Wallace (1855), entitled On the Law which has regulated the Introduction of New Species. Wallace believed that his "law" -newly discovered by himself - ...Wallace's argument, in effect, was a commentary on Lyell's vague and unspecific remarks about "creation" of new species. So now with Terry and JAD and Georgi we no longer have something AS vague and unspecific. Sure JAD seems a bit jaded calling em "muddleheaded" but what can science do if it is in the throws of a paradigm shift. How big & if religous comparision continue to spark the result is anyone's guess. Thanks again for the dialog with those two. {Added some blank lines between paragraphs and otherwise tweeked the formatting a bit. - Adminnemooseus} This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 04-07-2005 02:47 AM
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
Please see message 1 at the topic Lack of transitionals.
The above in turn cites this. I thought this has the makings for a good new topic, but I don't feel up to starting it myself. Any volunteers? Moose Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment. "Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham "The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." - John Kenneth Galbraith "I know a little about a lot of things, and a lot about a few things, but I'm highly ignorant about everything." - Moose
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