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Author Topic:   the book of job, and an unjust god
dpardo
Inactive Member


Message 152 of 181 (170953)
12-22-2004 7:19 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by sidelined
12-22-2004 6:46 PM


Sidelined writes:
And what of the ten commandments of Exodus 34.1
There is only one decalogue (set of 10 commandments).
I have already seen the other thread claiming that there are two.
Is this thread really the place to argue that?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by sidelined, posted 12-22-2004 6:46 PM sidelined has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by sidelined, posted 12-22-2004 8:00 PM dpardo has replied
 Message 174 by arachnophilia, posted 12-27-2004 5:40 AM dpardo has not replied

  
dpardo
Inactive Member


Message 154 of 181 (170964)
12-22-2004 8:15 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by sidelined
12-22-2004 8:00 PM


Sidelined writes:
If you wish we could start a thread to explore this but perhaps we should wait till after christmas to allow us to have free time to discuss this?
Sounds good.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by sidelined, posted 12-22-2004 8:00 PM sidelined has not replied

  
dpardo
Inactive Member


Message 169 of 181 (171550)
12-26-2004 11:08 AM
Reply to: Message 156 by arachnophilia
12-25-2004 12:33 AM


quote:
How was the the Pharaoh's heart hardened?
Was it not his own sin that caused this hardness?
quote:
And the LORD said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh: for I have hardened his heart
thank you come again.

1 Samuel 6:6:
6 Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?
Psalm 95:6-11:
6 O come, let us worship and bow down: let us kneel before the LORD our maker.
7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. Today if ye will hear his voice,
8 Harden not your heart,
as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.
10 Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways:
11 Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.
Mark 8:14-18:
14 Now the disciples had forgotten to take bread, neither had they in the ship with them more than one loaf.
15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.
16 And they reasoned among themselves, saying, It is because we have no bread.
17 And when Jesus knew it, he saith unto them, Why reason ye, because ye have no bread? perceive ye not yet, neither understand? have ye your heart yet hardened?
18 Having eyes, see ye not? and having ears, hear ye not? and do ye not remember?
Are you beginning to understand?
How does someone harden their heart?
By refusing to listen and insisting on having things their way.
Zechariah 7:7-14:
7 Should ye not hear the words which the LORD hath cried by the former prophets, when Jerusalem was inhabited and in prosperity, and the cities thereof round about her, when men inhabited the south and the plain?
8 And the word of the LORD came unto Zechariah, saying,
9 Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Execute true judgment, and shew mercy and compassions every man to his brother:
10 And oppress not the widow, nor the fatherless, the stranger, nor the poor; and let none of you imagine evil against his brother in your heart.
11 But they refused to hearken, and pulled away the shoulder, and stopped their ears, that they should not hear.
12 Yea, they made their hearts as an adamant stone,
lest they should hear the law, and the words which the LORD of hosts hath sent in his spirit by the former prophets: therefore came a great wrath from the LORD of hosts.
13 Therefore it is come to pass, that as he cried, and they would not hear; so they cried, and I would not hear, saith the LORD of hosts:
14 But I scattered them with a whirlwind among all the nations whom they knew not. Thus the land was desolate after them, that no man passed through nor returned: for they laid the pleasant land desolate.
What part does God play in this?
Romans 1:21-32:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
At some point, after continually refusing to listen to God, insisting on having your own way, persisting in your life of sin, God will give you over to it. He, in effect, grants you what you want.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by arachnophilia, posted 12-25-2004 12:33 AM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 170 by jar, posted 12-26-2004 12:04 PM dpardo has not replied
 Message 171 by arachnophilia, posted 12-27-2004 1:33 AM dpardo has replied

  
dpardo
Inactive Member


Message 176 of 181 (171707)
12-27-2004 10:55 AM
Reply to: Message 171 by arachnophilia
12-27-2004 1:33 AM


You have ignored everything I have said and continue to quote mine Exodus.
The reason I went outside of Exodus to show you those passages was so that you could understand how God works.
You can post the text with gigantic font sizes to focus on something, you can also open your eyes to see the big picture.
Exodus 9:16-17:
16 And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.
17 As yet exaltest thou thyself against my people, that thou wilt not let them go?
Pharaoh had his chances to obey and honor God, just as these Egyptians had a chance to save their servants and cattle from the plague of hail. Note the distinction here: The ones that feared God's word saved their servants and cattle, the REBELLIOUS ones did not.
Exodus 9:20-21:
20 He that feared the word of the LORD among the servants of Pharaoh made his servants and his cattle flee into the houses:
21 And he that regarded not the word of the LORD left his servants and his cattle in the field.
As I stated earlier, it is possible to disobey and dishonor God to such an extent that he will give you over to your sin completely and then you can never turn back.
Thus the many passages I quoted warning people not to harden their hearts. It all starts with you.
Will you give ear to or sear your conscience?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 171 by arachnophilia, posted 12-27-2004 1:33 AM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 177 by arachnophilia, posted 12-28-2004 1:43 AM dpardo has replied

  
dpardo
Inactive Member


Message 178 of 181 (171889)
12-28-2004 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 177 by arachnophilia
12-28-2004 1:43 AM


Arachnophilia writes:
of course the bible records that people who fear god prosper. the bible can be very biased.
Did Jesus and the prophets have a prosperous life on earth?
The bible is not "biased", it is truth.
Arachnophilia writes:
see the book of kings and the sin of jereboam. otherwise perfect kings are damned by the book because the neglected to tear down two temples and send everyone TO ANOTHER COUNTRY to worship.
The sin of Jeroboam:
1 Kings 13:33-34:
33 After this thing Jeroboam returned not from his evil way, but made again of the lowest of the people priests of the high places: whosoever would, he consecrated him, and he became one of the priests of the high places.
34 And this thing became sin unto the house of Jeroboam, even to cut it off, and to destroy it from off the face of the earth.
Ordaining priests which were not of the sons of Levi.
Also...
1 Kings 12:28-30:
28 Whereupon the king took counsel, and made two calves of gold, and said unto them, It is too much for you to go up to Jerusalem: behold thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.
29 And he set the one in Bethel, and the other put he in Dan.
30 And this thing became a sin: for the people went to worship before the one, even unto Dan.
Does this sound like "otherwise perfect" to you?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by arachnophilia, posted 12-28-2004 1:43 AM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 180 by arachnophilia, posted 12-31-2004 4:24 AM dpardo has not replied

  
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