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Author | Topic: anti-abortion folks still get abortions | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nator Member (Idle past 2198 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: The point is to show that the choice to have an abortion or not is a personal, individual choice, and that even those who seem to believe with all their hearts that abortion is murder and should be illegal still avail themselves of a safe, legal abortion when they have determined that they really need one. These people have no problem judging other people and feeling morally superior to them, but they suddenly have to construct a different moral standard for themselves when their own circumstances force them to have to confront the situation themselves. The point was to show the logical disconnet; that they believe that their abortion is the "only moral abortion", that somehow they can convince themselves their circumstances are completely different from every other woman's in the world. That is incredibly powerful, and uncovers a great truth about at least some in the anti-choice movement.
quote: What are you talking about??? All pro-choice organizations I have ever heard of or been involved with are also strong advocates of contraception, sexual health and responsibility education, family planning services, women's social and economic empowerment, enforcement of child care laws, and domestic violence education. It is the anti-choice people who want to keep young people ignorant of sexual health and contraception, limit family planning services as much as they can, make contraception harder to get (even wanting to allow pharmacists to not dispense prescriptions for contraception), etc. What kind of la-la land do you live in that you don't see that this is the case?
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
quote: The standard line of the anti-abortionists is to equate abortion to murdering a child. Thus if they get or even sanction an abortion in anything other than an extreme case they are either admitting that abortion is not the same as murdering a child - or that they consider murdering children to be roughly on a par with speeding or parking offences - certainly not the horrifying crime most of us would see it as. Which do you consider the more charitable reading ?t
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1495 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Most of these people who are for abortion, should be helping the world not have unwanted pregnancies, but you don't see that. No, actually the opposite is true. Pro-choice organizations continually and vocally lobby for improved access to birth control, sexual education, and other means that have a proven effectiveness in preventing unwanted pregnancy and the spread of STD's. On the other hand, not a single anti-abortion organization has come out in favor of birth control. Not a single one. Absolutely none of these organizations have lifted a finger in support of birth control, not ever. It's the anti-abortion crowd that does absolutely nothing at all to prevent unwanted pregnancy.
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AdminNWR Inactive Member |
Someone accused me of having an agenda, without any proof, or explaining why. Isn't that against forum rules?
The first mention of the word "agenda" in this thread occurred in Message 16, where you wrote "She has an agenda, I try not to." The second mention was by Funkaloyd in Message 17, where he wrote "If that's an agenda, then you have one too, and you're not trying very hard not to." He is not accusing you of having an agenda. He is questioning your use of "agenda" in Message 16. To comment on moderation procedures or respond to admin messages:
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nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
What do you think about the fact that anti-aborion activists have abortions?
Perhaps it is my warped sense of humor, but I found it simply hilarious. While it was surprising, it wasn't all that surprising. Humans are complex. They have amazing abilities to rationalize, so as to give themselves permission to do something that they would otherwise consider wrong.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3956 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
yes. abortion is just a quick fix for a deeper problem. but removing sex-ed from schools and making condoms unavailable to those under 18 and banning the morning after pill and making it illegal to disseminate birth control information are not the cure. the cure is raising educated, empowered, responsible children who understand the risks of sexual activity and can make responsible choices like postponing it and taking precautions. you know what the number one thing that sex ed does to kids? it makes them postpone their sexual activity. they didn't tell you that in bible camp did they?
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 763 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
you know what the number one thing that sex ed does to kids? it makes them postpone their sexual activity. "Abstinence-only" sex education does this, too. But there's a difference: 18 months after the class, when the kids from "A-o" class are out there doin' the horizontal bop, they are much less likely than kids that had real sex education to use condoms or other birth control. They're more likely to get pregnant or catch STD's. And I'll bet that makes them more likely to get an abortion.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3956 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
no. i meant a real postponement. like to age 20 rather than age 15.
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redseal Inactive Member |
The point is to show that the choice to have an abortion or not is a personal, individual choice
You are 100% correct on this point. I commend you. To sin or not is a personal, individual choice; it is not something foistered upon us.
and that even those who seem to believe with all their hearts that abortion is murder and should be illegal still avail themselves of a safe, legal abortion when they have determined that they really need one.
Those who proclaim abortion to be wrong, yet "avail themselves" abortions are modern-day Pharisees. Their lack of a moral back-bone and insincere proclamations puts them squarely amongst the other murderers.
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
redseal writes: You are 100% correct on this point. I commend you. To sin or not is a personal, individual choice; it is not something foistered upon us. That's "foisted"--I amend you. Foistered might be a useful word, though--a blend of foisted and cloistered: the imposition of narrow-mindedness upon the open-minded... To label something a sin or not is a personal, individual choice, based on nothing but the subjective embrace of one myth or another from among many, each in conflict with the others, none with any evidence for its special claims to Truth. Most Americans--and most people--do not support a total ban on abortion. By what right should an extreme minority position be imposed on others?
Those who proclaim abortion to be wrong, yet "avail themselves" abortions are modern-day Pharisees. Their lack of a moral back-bone and insincere proclamations puts them squarely amongst the other murderers. What brand of perfection keeps you from amongst the Pharisees? Do you claim to be a modern-day marvel, free of all hypocrisy? Already your sanctimony reeks in your own God's nostrils. Who owns the whole rainy, stony earth? Death. Who owns all of space? Death. Who is stronger than hope? Death.Who is stronger than the will? Death. Stronger than love? Death. Stronger than life? Death. But who is stronger than Death?Me, evidently. Pass, Crow. Ted Hughes, from "Examination at the Womb-Door"
Save lives! Click here!Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC! ---------------------------------------
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bob_gray Member (Idle past 5041 days) Posts: 243 From: Virginia Joined: |
quote:I'm not sure that this is the best sort of argument to use in this situation. I know I have often complained that the "unconstitutional" will of the majority is being foisted on the minority. My understanding is that the US system was set up to protect the minority from the majority. Don't get me wrong, I am 100% pro-choice, but this seems like a weak argument in any situation.
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3991 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
I know I have often complained that the "unconstitutional" will of the majority is being foisted on the minority. My understanding is that the US system was set up to protect the minority from the majority. Don't get me wrong, I am 100% pro-choice, but this seems like a weak argument in any situation. Best argument? Perhaps not. But it remains a fact. The US system was set up to do many complicated things, like granting the vote only to land-owning white men, but as to protecting the minority, I agree--they should not be required to have abortions, despite the obvious benefits to the rest of us. AbE: It also remains a fact that electoral numbers will determine abortion rights in the U.S. This message has been edited by Omnivorous, 03-25-2006 10:31 PM Who owns the whole rainy, stony earth? Death. Who owns all of space? Death. Who is stronger than hope? Death.Who is stronger than the will? Death. Stronger than love? Death. Stronger than life? Death. But who is stronger than Death?Me, evidently. Pass, Crow. Ted Hughes, from "Examination at the Womb-Door"
Save lives! Click here!Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC! ---------------------------------------
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 444 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
that even those who seem to believe with all their hearts that abortion is murder and should be illegal still avail themselves of a safe, legal abortion when they have determined that they really need one. Nobody hates a hypocrite more than me. But I still wouldn't use it to argue a point.
What kind of la-la land do you live in that you don't see that this is the case? Some good friends of mine run Care-netPregnancy Centers | Life Affirming Choices | Pro Abundant Life They have one facility across from the abortion clinic, and the way it was expressed to me, is that it wasn't a friendly relationship. But I know thats not the rule. But why is it I hear so much more about abortion, than help for unwanted pregnancies, or programs to encourage kids NOT to have sex. Having sex at a young age messes up your life, in more ways than one. Unfortunatly our society glorifies it, and it's solution is to have abortions, way to go.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 444 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
Which do you consider the more charitable reading ?t Niether, they are just mixed up people, who are hypocrites.There are many on both sides. Has nothing to do with the actual issue.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 444 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
Well, I didn't just unjustly accuse her of an agenda, I went to her web-site and read up on exactly what she stands for. Her agenda is listed, mine is not, there-for it is not the same, and funkaloyd is blowing smoke.
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