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Author
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Topic: What Does the Second Coming Entail?
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 60 of 238 (317498)
06-04-2006 5:09 AM
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Reply to: Message 58 by iano
06-03-2006 7:26 PM
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Re: Our first EvC conversion?
iano writes:
that Bob has a nightclub up there at the top floor (which you have never seen)
FAS, I'm prepared to believe that.
iano writes: that the club is impossibly expensive necessitating his paying with his own money for your entry. And you've never even met the guy.
Irrelevant. He's invited me in. He's paid the price. Can I come in now ?
iano writes: that the money he used to pay was valid and legal currency not Monopoly money
His problem, not mine. He's invited me in. He's paid the price. Can I come in now ?
iano writes: that he would somehow be able to get you up the top of this skyscraper without stairs or lifts
Ofcourse he can otherwise why the hell he's invited me ??. He is all-powerful Bob, after all!
iano writes: that Bob exists at all
FAS. I'm prepared to believe that. iano, you haven't done a 360 and now claim that there is a catch, have you ? 
Legend writes: let's recap: * Bob wants me to come to his club and he's paid the price. * Bob says I have the right to be in his club. * Bob says I can come in the club anytime I like, no catches. so, can I come in Bob's club or can't I ?! well, what is it?
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 58 by iano, posted 06-03-2006 7:26 PM | | iano has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 61 by Phat, posted 06-04-2006 5:14 AM | | Legend has replied | | | Message 80 by iano, posted 06-05-2006 4:52 PM | | Legend has replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 64 of 238 (317506)
06-04-2006 5:55 AM
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Reply to: Message 61 by Phat
06-04-2006 5:14 AM
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Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Phat writes: Bob expects you to put aside your agenda and love Him unconditionally
I thought it was him who loves us unconditionally. I also thought they weren't any catches, we're invited we can come in.
Phat writes: The first step is meeting Bob and the second step is trusting Bob.
?? I thought I could only meet him after I popped my clogs. Now as for trust, it's a two-way street. One can only trust people one knows and who have proved they deserve this trust. I think you meant to say 'the second step is having blind, unquestioning faith in Bob.'
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 61 by Phat, posted 06-04-2006 5:14 AM | | Phat has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 71 of 238 (317601)
06-04-2006 1:30 PM
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Reply to: Message 69 by Phat
06-04-2006 12:12 PM
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Re: This is getting rather funny
Phat writes: People would never turn Bob down who have met Him.
how do YOU know ?
Phat writes: If Bob is anything like His reputation, He will be known sooner or later.
I'll be waiting with bated breath.
Phat writes: Then people can draw their own conclusions based on Bob and not on Iano or myself
until then...
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 69 by Phat, posted 06-04-2006 12:12 PM | | Phat has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 72 of 238 (317602)
06-04-2006 1:34 PM
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Reply to: Message 70 by ringo
06-04-2006 1:29 PM
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spooky..
we both replied to the same Phat points at the same time saying approx. the same things. you reckon it's God trying to draw us to him or something ?
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 70 by ringo, posted 06-04-2006 1:29 PM | | ringo has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 73 of 238 (317604)
06-04-2006 1:46 PM
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Reply to: Message 66 by CK
06-04-2006 11:44 AM
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Hank's ass
quote:
sounds awfully like Hank.
brilliant stuff! I'll use it next time the missionaries come round.
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 66 by CK, posted 06-04-2006 11:44 AM | | CK has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 79 of 238 (318007)
06-05-2006 4:17 PM
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*bump* for iano
Legend writes:
let's recap: * Bob wants me to come to his club and he's paid the price. * Bob says I have the right to be in his club. * Bob says I can come in the club anytime I like, no catches. so, can I come in Bob's club or can't I ?!
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 81 of 238 (318056)
06-05-2006 5:57 PM
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Reply to: Message 80 by iano
06-05-2006 4:52 PM
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Re: Our first EvC conversion?
iano writes: I'm not sure what 'FAS' means, but my question is: why are you prepared to believe this? And what has preparedness to do with it? FAS = For Argument's Sake. I'm prepared to believe, for the sake of this discussion, the things you've asserted: * Bob wants me to come to his club and he's paid the price. * Bob says I have the right to be in his club. * Bob says I can come in the club anytime I like, no catches. * Even if I spill some beer, Bob still forgives me. I won't let the fact that neither of us has ever met Bob or know of anyone who's been to his club dissuade me from being prepared to believe that the above is true. Now the next stage: given the above, I assume it's ok for me to come in the club, right ?
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 80 by iano, posted 06-05-2006 4:52 PM | | iano has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 82 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 11:22 AM | | Legend has replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 83 of 238 (318293)
06-06-2006 11:45 AM
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Reply to: Message 82 by Phat
06-06-2006 11:22 AM
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Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Phat writes: You will be receiving a personal call from Bob very soon. I'll leave it up to you two to arrange a meeting.... is that some sort of threat ?! LOL are you and iano playing good cop / bad cop ?!
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 82 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 11:22 AM | | Phat has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 86 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 4:26 PM | | Legend has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 90 of 238 (318635)
06-07-2006 8:32 AM
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Reply to: Message 88 by Larni
06-07-2006 7:09 AM
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God's quirk
there's not one single verse that sums it up but throughout the scriptures dozens of chapters point to one direction only, I think important verses are: "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh...." (1Pet 3:18) "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) also reflected in Rom. 8:3-4, 2 Cor. 5:21 and many other passages in Paul's letters. Note that is doesn't say "For God so loved the world that he forgave us all and invited us all back in" oh no, God had to see some blood on the floor, even if it was his own Son's! Also note that Christ had to suffer for sins so that he can bring us to God. God likes to see someone suffer before he'll even think about forgiveness. Throughout the bible you can see that when God gets miffed someone has to suffer. There are no two ways about it. 2Pet 2:4-9 sums up what God did in the good old days and also what he threatens to do in the future unless you accept that he had to make his son suffer instead of us directly (though we do still suffer in out daily lives....I know....don't ask) You see, it's pretty clear that God isn't like you and I whereas we can forgive, forget and move on, oh no, God wants to see some blood on the matt and only then he'll begin to think about forgiveness (with terms & conditions ofcourse).
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 88 by Larni, posted 06-07-2006 7:09 AM | | Larni has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 91 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 8:40 AM | | Legend has replied | | | Message 97 by Phat, posted 06-07-2006 11:04 AM | | Legend has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 92 of 238 (318640)
06-07-2006 8:41 AM
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Reply to: Message 89 by Larni
06-07-2006 7:16 AM
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Re: My hangups
Larni writes: Are you saying that the xian god is a mean old bastard? if you take the whole of the bible as the true word of God, then that's the only conclusion I can come to about God. but don't take my word of it, read it for yourself. P..S and when I say read it I mean read it throughout and in context, don't just pick the nice verses that make you feel warm and fuzzy inside, like a lot of Christians seem to do. Edited by Legend, : added P.S
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 89 by Larni, posted 06-07-2006 7:16 AM | | Larni has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 94 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 10:01 AM | | Legend has not replied | | | Message 153 by Larni, posted 06-09-2006 3:54 AM | | Legend has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 99 of 238 (318708)
06-07-2006 11:14 AM
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Reply to: Message 91 by iano
06-07-2006 8:40 AM
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Re: Legendary quirks
iano writes: That you accept his invite you mean? Strange contortion of the English language that. Someone offers to give you something and you not accepting it is a term and condition of them offering it? iano writes: That you accept his invite you mean? Strange contortion of the English language that. Someone offers to give you something and you not accepting it is a term and condition of them offering it? it was only a few posts ago that you, yourself, iano, said that we were all invited, we have the right to come in, no catches, remember ? the invite has been issued. Fullstop. I can be courteous and send a written acceptance or I can just turn up at the door. This is up to me, but the invite still stands. No catches, remember ? you're not now saying that the condition is that we accept that his son dies for our sins,etc, or else we can't come in, are you ? that sounds very much like a condition to me. BTW, a few pages back you have an open *bump* post waiting for clarification.
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 91 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 8:40 AM | | iano has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 108 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 12:26 PM | | Legend has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 100 of 238 (318711)
06-07-2006 11:22 AM
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Reply to: Message 93 by iano
06-07-2006 8:59 AM
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Re: the whys whens and hows
iano writes: He can hate evil. But his hating is not like most of our hating ...... just like his justness is not like most of our justness.. and his love is not like our love...... and his mercy is not like our mercy..... again, read 2Pet 2:4-9 to understand what his justness, love and mercy are like.
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 93 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 8:59 AM | | iano has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 101 of 238 (318721)
06-07-2006 11:40 AM
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now I'm getting it!
iano writes: You can pre-suppose that if it is the word of God then inconsistant it will not be. Apparent inconsistancy can be laid aside for a time using the simple technique known as "pointing the finger at my own limitations in getting it and not supposing there to be an inconsistancy because of those limitations" what a fantastic piece of advice! If you think something doesn't make sense then just assume it's you being stupid and 'not getting it' - not that the text is a mangled old myth - heaven forbid! we have to find a way to spread this to the children, we'll have a new generation full of intelligent, critical thinkers. I challenge you Ian to read the Quran, following your own pre-supposition, as above. You'll be a Musilm in no time!
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 107 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 12:13 PM | | Legend has replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 104 of 238 (318729)
06-07-2006 12:00 PM
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Reply to: Message 95 by CK
06-07-2006 10:48 AM
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God's love, mercy and justness
quote:
Exodus 12:29-30: "And it came to pass, that at midnight the LORD smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the firstborn of cattle. And Pharaoh rose up in the night, he, and all his servants, and all the Egyptians; and there was a great cry in Egypt; for there was not a house where there was not one dead."
those damned Egyptian babies were all sinners, they just had to pay! Or their fathers were anyway, so the babies deserved what they got! I'm sure they're all burning in hell as we speak! ...same goes for the cattle too. damn those sinful calfs!
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 95 by CK, posted 06-07-2006 10:48 AM | | CK has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 106 by CK, posted 06-07-2006 12:04 PM | | Legend has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5036 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 114 of 238 (318806)
06-07-2006 4:04 PM
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Reply to: Message 113 by CK
06-07-2006 1:48 PM
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Re: Am God (dogma in reverse)
iano writes:
You mean his dogma that the bible isn't the word of God isn't a dogma?
are you aware of the difference between 'dogma' and 'conclusion' ?
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 113 by CK, posted 06-07-2006 1:48 PM | | CK has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 116 by CK, posted 06-07-2006 4:27 PM | | Legend has not replied |
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