The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil and The Tree of Life (Lost /Reformed Thread)

Baily, I don't see how you can have it both ways. Now if you want to be strict to what is written there and point out that we have nothing proving that Adam was told of the significance of the Tree of Life, then be consistent.It is not explicitly written that he was told either before or after the expulsion from Eden. If you hold my feet to the fire and say there is no passage telling us that, then be consistent. Neither is there any passage telling us of an explanation after his expulsion.If you speculate that he was told about it afterwards, I can with equal validity speculate that he was told beforehand. Life and Death are constrasted throughout the rest of the Bible.
There will remain a dichotomy until death, "the last enemy," is destroyed (1 Cor. 15:26). God warned man not to eat of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. You are changing the content of the account.It is one thing to speculate about something which is not mentioned. It is more serious to teach the opposite of what is plainly written.What God spoke is what He intended. And that was "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." (Genesis 2:17)God hates death more than He hates sin. I won't agree with any suggestion that God spoke for man not to eat but intended man to eat.When Adam ate, God speaks again "Have you eaten of the tree of which I commanded you not to eat?" (Gen. 3:11)Your exegesis of the passage is too wild for me. Though you thought through some things rather intently, still I find your treatment of the plain utterances to be wildly taking liberties.In understanding the Bible it is very important to master the FACTS presented. You have to start interpreting after you are clear about the facts which are presented. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : Wrong Reference - Gen. 2:17 is right.

I admited that there is no explicit conversation. You say 3:22 is your ground that God spoke of its nature after his disobedience. I can only grant a "possibly" because God seems to be speaking to God and not to Adam."And Jehovah said, Behold tha man has become like one of Us ..."I don't know that Adam was listening to that. So "possibly" is all I can say. The expulsion occured AFTER the deception. Before either the word mentions to the reader about the tree of life.The speaking to the reader - Gen. 2:9.
The deception to Eve and Adam - Gen.3:1-7.
The expulsion of Adam and Eve - Gen. 3:22-24.This is what I mean by first getting the biblical facts right, before embarking on interpretation. The absence of such a conversation is no proof that it did not occur. It was not recorded.Why the tree of life would be a secetive matter hidden from Adam, I cannot surmise. And that is the thrust of your opinion here. I don't know what this thing is that you have with "the Lovebirds"
But the covering of Adam and Eve with the coats of the slain animals occured AFTER the deception.And the speaking of the trees from which Adam could or could not eat took place BEFORE the deception and the disobedence.God speaks of the trees to Adam - Gen.2:16.
Eve is deceived and Adam disobeys - Gen. 3:1-7.
God covers Adam and Eve with the cattle skin - Gen. 3:21. That is after they disobeyed the instructions and discovered that they were naked. The TWO TREES first spoken of together only appears to the reader in Gen.2:9.We see no explicit mention of them both together until after Asam's disobedience.You have some point about this? Okay.We certainly can find the explanation. It begins with the word "Therefore" in verse 23. And it begins with the word "So" in verse 24.As a friend told me that in the Bible when you encounter a "Therefore" you have to find out what the "therefore" is there for."THEREFORE ... Jehovah God sent him [EXPULSION] forth from the garden of Eden, to work the ground frm which he was taken." (v.23)"SO ... He [God] drove the man out, and at the east of the garden of Eden He placed a cherubim and a flaming sword which turned in every dirrection to guard the way to the tree of life." (Gen.3:24)If we look back to see what the words "Therefore" and "So" refers to, it is of course the preceeding information in verse 22: [b]"And Jehovah God said, Behold, that man has become as one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he pu forth his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat and live forever." (v.22).The expulsion is so that man would not reach out with his hand and also eat from the tree of life and live forever in addition to him having taken of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.He is through with Paradise, for now. He is through with having the right to eat of the tree of life.I will have to skip down a little. It may say that "every tree of the garden that is pleasant to the sight and good for food" (2:9). But it also says that Adam was forbidden by God to eat one - the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.It may say that Eve say that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was "good for food and a delight to the eyes" (3:6). But it was still commanded of the couple not to eat of it. He told them of His intention. And it was for them NOT to eat of it. I believe that we should seek to understand it. But be careful. Don't change what is said there to fit into what you "understand".The question of what was God's intention should first and foremost be derived from what God stated as His intention. And that was that they would not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. I will not follow you over that cliff.Are you rebelling against what we are told was the heart of God concerning the matter?Do you realize that if the serpent were to sit down with Adam and Eve and have a study of God's words up to that point, he would twist God's words to deceive them.You and I are not above being deceived. One way we can not be deceived so easily is to pay attention carefully to the clear utterance of God's intention. Say Amen to it. I will not follow you over that cliff and into that abyss.You're on your own there. No comment. The human conscience was awakened. But it was a step down and away from God and into death and sin and degredation.You are trying to salvage some benefit of Adam's disobedience.The only benefit I will derive from that disobedient act of Adam is two words only - Jesus Christ. You can dispute God's wisdom. I will not follow you there to "dispute God's wisdom". That is what the serpent did. That is what the Devil does. That is what Satan intends.It is not a game to me. Adam chose the wrong tree. This is beyond argument to me.God can cause all things to work together for good to those who live Him and are called according to His purpose (Rom. 8:29).I have to discontinue now for a time.It is so good to simply say AMEN to the word of God.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

That is like saying that until there was death there was no need for God.Man was created with a life which was very good. I don't believe that he had any reason to die. He had a created life which God could maintain everlastingly.The tree of life represents more than this. It represents not the created life but the uncreated life which is God Himself. That divine Person God intends to impart into man for a divine and human incorporation. It is more than he would have been in the presense of God with sin. He would have been incorporated and mingled with God bringing sin into this incorporation.Imagine a sinful Jesus Christ. God would never have the mingling of God and man which included forever man's sinfulness.This violates His holy nature. This insults His eternal glorey. And this trangresses His righteous being.The cherubim stands for the glory of God.
The sword stands for the righteousness of God.
The slame of the sword stands for the holiness of God.This three-fold barrier fixed a gulf between man and God which cannot be crossed. God's salvation is needed to cause man to meet the demand for God's glory, and righteousness, and holiness. That demand is met in the coming, death, and resurrection of the Son of God. I am not sure what you mean by this. But anyway that is quite a big difference. Of course we might have done that anyway.I did say that Jesus Christ is the benefit of it all. I don't see it that way. By this time had Adam obeyed God, he might be tending the whole solarsystem or perhaps the whole galaxy rather than just the garden in Eden. Who really knows. What is is what is.I really need not waste too much time on what could have been because Adam fell. And in that fall the Triune God came in to accomplish His salvation and bring man back to His eternal purpose.At any rate my thanks is directed towards the Author of salvation.If I want to be thankful towards Someone for salvation, I direct my thanks towards the Triune God. I do not direct my thanksgiving towards Adam.

Well, before sin is a problem God has already placed the tree of life for man to eat. So we cannot say that it was purely remedial to solve the problem of sin and death.The tree of life is not only for the problem of sin and death. It is for the purpose of man's creation. God predestinated to have sons not only after man had sinned, but "before the foundation of the world". In other words, before the creation of the universe.Right here -"Even as He chose us before the foundation of the world to be holy and without blemish before Him in love, predestinating us unto sonship through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will ..." (Eph. 1:5)Sons of God here are people with the divine life and nature of God their Father.Yes, Adam was a direct creation of God. But Adam did not have the life and nature of God within him. That life and nature was for his partaking from the tree of life.To be fair, I know that the Gospel of Luke discribes Adam as "the sons of God" as also the angels are sometimes called the sons of God (Luke 3:38; Job 1:6;2:1; 38:7Psa. 89:6) But these are not sons of God as those with God's life imparted into them as we see here:" ... He might redeem those under the law that we might receive the sonship. And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (Gal, 4:5,6)

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"For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus." (Gal.3:26)

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" ... you might become partakers of the divine nature ..." (2 Peter 1:4).

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"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the authority to become children of God, to those who believe into His name, who were begotten not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:12,13)Taking the tree of life was at that time the event of regeneration. Man needs regeneration not only because he is sinful ICANT. Man needs regeneration because he is natural and was not created with the divine nature or the divine seed of God within him.Consider John 1:12,13 again. The new birth there is NOT of three things and is OF one thing:1.) It is not of blood. "Who were begotten not of blood ..."It is not passed on from parent to child naturally in the physical blood.2.) It is not of the will of the flesh - "who were begotten ... nor of the will of the flesh"The flesh here is a negative term meaning the fallen man. The new birth cannot be willed into existence by the will power of the fallen man. He cannot produce it religiously by power of the fallen man.3.) It is also not of the will of the good man God created before the fall - "Who were begotten ... nor of the will of man". The new birth cannot be produced even by the will of the unfallen and sinless man. The good man, the man before the fall of Adam, even he cannot produce the regeneration.The new birth of regeneration is of God. It is of the begetting Father who dispenses His life into man.Who were begotten ... but of God"After God created man man was not created a regenerated son of God. This was the job of eating from the tree of life, to dispense the life of God into man. Man needs regeneration to fulfill God's purpose for his creation.A good man may be a innocent man. God has many innocent angels. He has many good angels. They are not the sons of God with the divine nature of God that He purposed to have before the foundation of the world. They are not the partakers of sonship.In traditional Christianity we were taught that man needs to be born again because he is a fallen sinner. What I say to you now is that even if man is not a guilty sinner, he still needs regeneration to accomplish the pleasure of God to have sons of God with His seed, with His divine life and nature.In short - the life of the tree of life is not only a remedial issue to deal with man's sins. The life of the tree of life is an issue that deals with man's purpose for being created.God can have a good man that lives forever but is not a son of God. Adam, from the moment he was created was such a man. Of course after eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, sin and death entered into him. Of course he could not partake of the tree of life in that condition (Gen.3:22) UNTIL the salvation of Christ is received. From the standpoint of God's eternal purpose for man before the foundation of the world, Adam DID need to partake of the life of God.This life of God has now gone through a process and placed in a form in which we can receive Him on this side of the fall of Adam. That process is incarnation, human living, death, resurrection, and becomming the life giving Spirit.So it is absolutely right to think of Jesus Christ as the tree of life to man today. He is God who passed through - incarnation, human living, death, resurrection, ascension, enthronement, and becoming the life giving Spirit - "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)We have the processed Triune God to be dispensed into us as the tree of life. I simply used the term very good as Genesis 1:34 says that God looked upon all that He had made and it was very good. Something got into man's being. Something got into man's body. So it was not simply a matter of commiting a transgression. It was also a matter of being poisoned with something.This is seen in Romans 7 and in other places.

I agree with this. But I would like to draw your attention to one phrase you used - God in the flesh. "God in the flesh" is His eternal purpose.Yes, God incarnate did die for lost man. Yes, God in the flesh payed the debt of man's sins. But even apart from the problem of sin God intended to have God in the flesh. He created man as a vessel to contain Himself.You are right. And I am attempting to show that in addition to this there is more. But we should realize that God did not create man for the purpose of forgiving man. Yes, God does forgive the sinner because of justfication in Christ. But do you think apart from Him forgiving our sins there was no plan in His heart?When God rested on the seventh day it was not because of tiredness. This rest signifies satisfaction and having accomplished something. What do we have there? We have man made in the image of God according to the likeness of God. And this man is committed with dominion.We do not see only a Sabbath rest after salvation and forgiveness is accomplished. We see a Sabbath rest of God in satisfaction before the disobedience of man. This shows us that God has a with creation quite apart from redemption. Redemption brings man back to the original plan.God wanted a corporated man that looks like God and excercises dominion over His creation for God as a deputy authority. Especially God wanted man to have dominion over His enemies led by Satan. Image and dominion are two key words here.Image is to express God. Dominion is to reign for God. That is especially to reign over His enemy.This man was prepared by God and staged to receive the life of God within him. So He placed man before the tree of life. Man is ready then to receive the divine life of God within his human vessel and accomplish God's eternal purpose. All this is before the intrance of sin and death. And at this stage God rests in satisfaction having all things ready for the accomplishing of His eternal purpose.I do not believe that God created man simply for the purpose of forgiving man of his sins, though He certainly does accomplish that in Christ. The word adoption in the King James is not a good translation. Literally the word means "the place of a son". The RcV has there "sonship".Adoption, may be understood by many as simply a legal matter. Sonship is a matter of life. It is "organic". God intended not simply to adopt sons. He intended to beget sons with His life and nature for a corporate expression of the divine family.These sons were predestinated to have the life and nature of God as thier Father, before the they or the universe was created. Participation in His life is a matter of God dispension Himself into them.When we see prior to man's sinning, Adam before the tree of life, we see the created man placed in the position ready to receive the divine life of God to be a son of God. This is not being a son merely by a legal adoption but by an organic begetting.Man before the tree of life reveals man ready to receive into him the life of God to be regenerated a son of God to occupy the place of a son. It is true that on this side of the fall of man we can achieve this sonship only through Christ's redemption. Following His redemption God implants the divine seed of His life into the man -"Everyone who has been begotten of God does not sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been begotten of God." (1 John 3:9)Do not misunderstand my intention here. I am not proposing a teaching of "sinless perfection" upon the moment one is born again. There the matter of the growth and maturing of the seed of life which is a process.My purpose in quoting 1 John 3:9 is to show that after judicial redemption there is the organic matter of God dispensing His seed of life into man. You should regard this as the same as Adam eating of the tree of life. The tree of life signifies God imparting His own life into man making man organically a son of God, born of a uncreated and divine Father. This is more than being created by God.There are millions of angelic beings created by God. The man He made in His image and according to His likeness was a vessel created to contain God as life.God had a eternal purpose to dwell in man as His living vessel. He created the universe for this. The world there you read as "blame" is better translated in the Recovery Version (RcV) as blemish. A blemish is like a foreign particle in a precious gem. God's chosen ones should be saturated with only God Himself, having no foreign particles. This again underlines that man is created as a vessel to contain.No blemish is no foriegn particle in the container of man's vessel. The foreign particles that did enter into man's vessel were the fallen natural human element, the flesh, the self, and worldly things. To be without blemish is to be without any foreign element in the human vessel as a mixture.God created this human vessel to contain God Himself as the indwelling element.Holy and without blemish speaks of God dispensing His life and nature into man. God alone is holy - "You alone are holy" (Rev.15:4). There are only two ways in which anything else can become holy. Either it is consecrated and set apart by God for Himself, such as the holy angels, or it is living and has God dispense His holy nature into that living one. In Ephesians we are made holy by God dispensing His life into us.The holy nature of God is a nature distinct from all other things in existence. Man was created to receive this nature dispensed into him. No foreign element was to take its place. So the sons of God were predestinated to receive the dispensing of God's holy life and nature as their element. This destiny was marked out for them before the foundation of the world. I have tried to show that sonship is a better translation. And sonship emphasizes not just the legality of the Father but the organic begetting of the Father - a matter of life.Now remember man before the tree of life in the garden. This may help you to see that before sin entered, God already had an eternal purpose to dispense His life into man for sonship and to constitute man with the element of God's life, having God's seed of life. Yes we have, who are members of His Body, the church. All these matters are quite true. But you should also include regeneration. That is the impartation of the seed of life into man. There is the judicial side to place the saved in a right legal position before a righteous God. But this is followed by an organic matter. God's life is dispensed into man that man may be saturated and filled up with the life of God.Man before the tree of life and before the sin of Adam, demonstrates that this was God's eternal plan even apart from solving the sin problem.Redemption, Reconcilation, Justification bring man back to the organic matter of God dispensing His life and nature into man's vessel. In Genesis 1:26,27 it says so: Genesis 2:7 about God breathing the breath of life into the nostrils of the man formed of the dust does not make Genesis 1:26,27 not true. We should receive both passages about the creation of man.You may think of man being made in the image of God like a glove being in the image of a human hand. God created man in a certain "God shaped" way so that God could fit into man comfortably. As the hand fits into the glove made in its image so God fits right into the man made in His image.He made man in the image of God in order that man would be a vessel to contain God:The Apostle Paul underscores that man is created a vessel to contain God."But we have this treasure in earthen vessels that the excellency of the power may be of God and not of us." (2 Cor. 4:7)The saved is the vessel. The life of God in Christ is the treasure put into the earthen vessel."In order that He [God] might make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He had before prepared unto glory." (Rom. 9:23)God here prepared the chosen ones before hand to be vessels of glory. We are indeed created in His image to be a living vessel from within which He manifests His expression - His glory."If therefore anyone cleanses himself from these, he will be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, useful to the master, prepared for every good work." (2 Tim. 2:21)As useful vessel to the Lord is a vessel filled up with the life of the Lord. Even to receive the seed of divine life man must be made a container, a vessel. Genesis 1:26,27 and Genesis 2:7) are just two different passages on the creation of man. You should not thing that they cancel out each other in any way. One does not render the other wrong. We should accept them both.I have emphasized that Genesis 1:26,27 shows that man is made in God's image as a vessel to contain God. Actually this can be seen in Genesis 2:7 with Proverbs 20:27."Jeovah formed man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul." (Gen. 2:7)The Hebrew word neshamah (as in "breath of life", translated spirit in Proverbs 20:27.The breath of life breathed into man's body became the spirit of man within him, that is the human spirit.Proverbs 20:27 says "The spirit of man is the lamp of the Jehovah, searching all the innermost parts of the inner being"The spirit of man acting as the lamp of Jehovah to search all of man's innermost parts, proves that man is a vessel. His innermost parts can be ulluminated by the lamp of Jehovah which is the human spirit breathed into him at creation. The innermost parts and the inner being is the inward components of man's psychological being. Probabably the spiritual being is indicated as well.Man in God's image set before the tree of life shows man as a vessel to contain the life of God. And man with a spirit in him searching all his innermost parts also shows man as a living vessel, a container.Man's spirit is his inward organ for him to contact God, receive God, contain God, and assimilate God into his entire being as his life and everything.God‘s Economy: recovered by Witness Lee, enjoyed by local churches is a great website speaking to this.So is Tripartite Man: refs. include Watchman Nee and Witness Lee In his fallen natural state he is sinful.But remember before Adam sinned he was in a natural state. He was not sinful. He was innocent. He was neutral. And he was placed before the tree of life in the middle of the garden of Eden.Adam was natural but was not sinful. And the tree of life was there not to deal with sins which he had not done. But it was there to fill him with the life of God for the purpose of God. Amen. The Holy Spirit seals us and is also a forestaste of a fuller taste to come. He is filled with the self - the independent soul life.But when you get a chance read carefully through Romans chapter 7. Tell me then in that chapter what is "the body of this death?"I think you will do a thorough job if you study the chapter carefully.Agape,Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Greetings Bertot,We know in part and prophesy in part, so I'm sure I could easily make a mistake. Tell me when you don't agree.In my enthusiasm to speak of the uniqueness of man it may appear that I am under appreciating the angels. I don't think there is too much danger in under appreciating angel nature.But you point out something which I would like to spend more time to consider. I'll try to get back with an answer after some study. I need to review what I wrote about angels in relation to "the image of God".Probably the place I would start to study is the phrase "in the image of God". Perhaps, all I will be able to do is highlight some of the differences between human destiny in God's plan from angel destiny. And your insight into the matter will help us to get a more rounded and balanced picture.Praise the Lord for the study of His revelation, the Bible.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

I think that the very first choice that God enabled man to have was between LIFE and DEATH. That was the primary choice of man. " ... the tree of life in the middle of the garden and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil" (1:9)
The tree of the knowledge of good and evil was acgually the tree of death and to eat of it was to choose DEATH.Or let me say it another way. The first choice that God enabled His creature man to have was God's way or another way. There was God's way and then there was the OTHER way.Adam made his first choice, death. Adam made his first choice - not God's way but the other way.Now, man has made his first choice - not life but death. Not God as life but the knowledge of good and evil. Now that man has made this first choice of DEATH the conscience of man is activated. Now, made has activated within him the ability to choose right from wrong, good as opposed to evil, or evil as opposed to good.I would put it this way. His fall from God's way caused the abiloty to choose good or evil to awaken. This seems to me to be like a internal brake system designed in man just in case something goes wrong.It is like the airbag in a car. You hope you never have to use it. But just in case, the wise designers have built it into the vehicle. Man's ability to choose right or wrong was activated and awakened as an emergence brake system to prevent man from even further self destruction. I agree. I think that that is part of the first level. To choose God's way or to choose the other way is probably a matter of loving God. We get in trouble when we love something more than God. That becomes a replacement, an idol.It seems that Adam was enticed to place something else as more important to love than God. Okay. It seems that we discussed something about this before. I think to someone I felt to point out that angels also could make a choice between God's way and another way.But I don't want to make a big deal about that because I think destraction to angel nature is not something I want to be too much overly occupied with.Suffice it to say, on my part, that the good angels are good servants to God. Of course the bad angels went off to do their own thing under the leadership of Satan. Praise the Lord. That was more than a service. That was a meeting in His name He doesn't seem to want to usurp the human will. Praise the Lord for the sonship and for the wonderful new birth which brings us into the sonship. What a great miracle has occured in our beings who have been born of God!I hope more who come and read along these discussions would be born of God in regenaration - Witness Lee & Watchman Nee teach regeneration Rightly taught, it is very good to know. When I used the phrase "sinless perfection" I was using it the holiness theology teaches, which is not good.But a proper understanding of 1 John 3:9 is crucial. I agree with you that 1 John 3:9 should not be ignored. Above I only needed that passage to point out that God imparts His life into the saved ones. And to impart His life was His purpose from the creation of man and the placing him before the tree of life.Some people object to me saying man was placed before the tree of life. But I really mean that it was in the middle of the garden. It was central.I can hear someone object "Well, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was also in the middle of the garden. Why don't you say that God placed man before it?"My reply would be, "Yes, that tree of death was in the middle of the garden. BUT, man was told specifically not to partake of it. So I prefer to emphasize that man was placed before the tree of life in the middle of the garden." That is exactly right. You have something within you which is sinless. Even more, if you are born again, you have something within you which is God Himself. - "He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit" (1 Cor. 6:17)The Recovery Version is very good with this matter of the capitalization or smaller case s (Spirit / spirit). It makes the New Testament clearer by far, in my experience.The Holy Bible Recovery VersionDeep within you are mingled with God, blended with God, and one spirit with the Lord. That spirit cannot sin. So that is the realm into which we need to be strengthened - with power into the inner man. We need to set our mind on the mingled spirit. We need to excercise our mingled spirit where Jesus is within us.My spirit cannot sin. My spirit overcomes the world. So I need to allow my spirit to be strengthened and have more and more enfluence over my mind, emotion, and will and body.Now to be thorough and fair, there is one verse which talks about the defilement of spirit. But this is still not the sinning of the spirit. This is something reauireing another discussion which I will not detail right now.I would only say, that as water can be made defiled as it passes through a dirty hose, so can our regenerated spirit pick up some defilement as it flows through our untransformed soul. That unclean soul can pollute the stream of spiritual flow and cause the defilement of spirit. That is not the sinning of the spirit where the seed of God is. That is a tainting and coloring of the spirit as it flows out of us through an unclean soul.This we need to correct by allowing the tranformation of the soul to be a clean vessel through which the spirit flows out to others. The human (small s) spirit is what is born again of the (captital S) Spirit which is God.The way I would write your above sentence is like this: Let me say that the glorifacation of the physical body must await the coming of the Lord.But the salvation of the mind must occur before the coming of the Lord. This transformation of the mind must start and progress in the church age.Our soul cannot be transformed unless we undergo the renewing of the mind: Please notice. This is not Paul saying we should wait for the new heaven and new earth before our mind is renewed. This is Paul teaching that now in the church age, before the second coming of Christ, we need to be transformed by the renewing of our mind.The mind is the leading organ of the soul. The mind, the emotion, and the will make up the soul. The soul must be transformed in the church age by the renewing of its leading part - the mind.If we postpone this process, it is second best. God has provision for our procrastination. But it is not too sweet to have to undergo that.It is best, and it is more normal that we do not put off the transformation because the Holy Spirit is spreading into our mind. In fact by the renewing of the mind we are putting on the new man. We are being tranformed from the old man to the new man by the metabolic change in the mind: As the mind is being renewed, in the church age before Jesus returns, the soul is putting on the new man. The transformation is our way out of the old man and into the new man dispositionally.This transformation should take place in the church age. We may put it off and we can put it off if we wish to be abnornal. But there will be unpleasant consequences for out foolish disregard of this process of transformation.If we wish to be normal we should give our minds over to the Lord for transformation in the church age. The exhortations of the New Testament refer to transformation of the soul before the Lord's return as an obligation. Those who participate in it will receive a reward.Here again we see transformation of the soul not after the second coming but before in the church age from the Lord's Spirit. The Lord Spirit who is one spirit with the born again believer is there for our transformationa from one degree of expression of Christ to the next degree, to the next degree .... from glory to glory to glory to glory into the image of Christ.This beholding and reflecting requires loging more and more time in the presence of the Lord. It means beholding Him in our spirit. Beholding Him in the living word. Beholding Him in all kinds of situations. Even instantly beholding Him. That is gazing at Him deep within us. Turning our heart to Him within and lingering in His presence. We log more and more time with Him.This causes us to behold and reflect Him. And that transforms our soul more and more to be like Him. That is my understanding. Though he did not eat of the tree of life, he had an everlasting life. God could maintain him.However the history is that he took into himself DEATH. And not only so he was exiled from the tree of life which he had not taken. Man was "alienated from the life of God" (Eph. 4:18)What could have been, we may not understand too well. But what can be we know better from the gospel. We can partake of Jesus Christ as the life. He is the life of God come to us in a man and furthermore as the life giving Spirit - "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45) It is important to realize that God's full salvation includes all three parts of our being - the spirit, the soul, and the body. Notice here all three parts of man are to be sanctified - the human spirit, the human soul, and the human body. That is to be sanctified "wholly".If we die our bodies will be resurrected. If we are alive when He comes our bodies will be raptured and transfigured. Either way our bodies with be transfigured.The mortal will be swallowed up in life. We will put on the immortal. The mortal body of the Christian is to be swallowed up in the divine life which is already in our spirit. It is in our spirit and seeking ever to migrate out into our soul. Eventually it has to spread into our soul and burst out into our physical body.This is no being found naked or unclothed as a naked spirit before God. This is to be clothed upon with a new glorified body.I was very excited when I realized that God's full salvation included every part of my being. Previously I envisioned heaven as us being like ethereal clouds floating around. But then I realize from the New Testament how exceedingly practical God's salvation was.It includes the regeneration of the human spirit, the transformation of the human soul, and finally the transfiguration of the human body.This is the redemption of the body in Romans 8:23 and the transfiguration of our body in Phil. 3:219.I must discontinue here. Praise God for you fellowship.

Refering to Genesis 1:26-28 you wrote: It is the same creation of human beings which we read about in Genesis 2:7You have a record of Jesus's birth in Matthew. You also have one in Luke. The details stressed are different. They are not two conflicting accounts. But they are two accounts.The passage of Genesis 2:7 speaks of man's creation from one angle. Genesis 1:26-28 speak of man's creation from another angle. This passage gives a detail which was not spoken in Genesis 1:26, that is that man's body was formed of the dust of the ground. The detail of the wife being taken from the rib of Adam is not spoken of in Genesis 1:26.Even Man in relation to the creating of animals is sequenced differently. The emphasis is different.These two sections should not be viewed as opposing each other. They hold some differences. But I do not regard them as opposed.It is two versions of the same matter. If that were true it would make Genesis 1:26 not true. But I prefer to believe that both passages have to be true for both are the word of God.They may be difficult in places to reconcile facts. But this is sometimes the case under God's sovereignty.Genesis 2:5 says "And no plant of the field was yet in the earth, and no herb of the field had yet sprung up - for Jehovah God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was no man to work the ground ...The phrase "was yet in the earth" may be local to "the field". The seer of that vision may have had a more resticted vision.If Adam was created in the morning and the wife taken out of his side by the evening, it would be true by that evening that God created them male and female. Would it not?If for Adam's sake God decided to reserve the making of some aninals so the the newly created man could see what was done, He did them in the garden after Adam is there, that would make both passages true also."And Jehovah God formed from the ground every animal of the field and every bird of heaven, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called any living animals, that was its name. And tje an gave names to all cattle and to the birds of heaven and to every animal of the field, but for Adam there was not found a helper as his counterpart"The emphasis is different. The purpose of the account in chapter two may have a different focus. That is all.I have to come back to this latter. I am called away.So the creation of man and the woman must have occured on the sixth day. And on that day generally God had created them male and female and He had created man in His own image.Now the matter of some of the plant life may be hard to reconcile fully, given the information we have. I don't consider that my not being able to explain what happened to all plant life renders one of the passages as false.I trust God that His word is pure. I have no doubt that we are being told the truth in Genesis 1:26-28 and in Genesis 2:7. I think forcing one to mean that the other is not true will involve me in more theological problems and not less.I therefore think that God intentionally determined that there would seemingly be a difference in the two sections. We are on the test not God. It is a test to us. By the time the woman is brought to the man it is true that " ... God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." (Genesis 1:27)I see nothing in chapter 2 which makes Genesis 1:27 impossible to be a FACT.I will continue latter with response.Remember the sweetness of Jesus and above all His glorious resurrection.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Yes, I noticed those verses years ago. My first serious study of Genesis was done in the early 70s.I am not sure if the two passages can be reconciled to the satisfaction of everyone. However, I think that a possibility is that the second account of creation (Gensis2:4-25) is more local.And by local I mean pertaining to the garden of Eden. Although I have never read such, possibly this was the account passed on by Adam himself to his descendents - (pure speculation on my part).But notice verse 8 - "And Jehovah God planted a garden in Eden, in the east; and there He put the man whom He had formed. And out of the ground Jehovah caused to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight ...etc."The phrase " ... no plant of the field was yet in the earth, and no herb of the field had yet sprung up ..." could be local to the garden of Eden. In Adam's experience in the garden, maybe he saw a sample of what God had previously done elsewhere before man's creation.It may be the case that what God did before the creation of man, was partially demonstrated to Adam in the garden. That is that Adam could witness the formation of plant and animal lives in "the field" of Eden.But I don't know for sure. I permit each portion of Scripture to state its disclosure in the manner in which it wishes to. I trust God's word although there are some contradictions or paradoxes difficult to reconcile.I consider any paradox or contradiction there to be a test not to the veracity of Scripture as much, but as a test to my own trust of God.I will review some other opinions. And if I think they are significantly helpful, I may submit them. I do not think that two different first men are being spoken about. I think that introduces far more problems than it could possibly solve. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

I see.Did you notice that Paul refers to Adam as "the first man"? - "So also it is writen, the first man Adam, became a living soul..." (1 Cor. 15:45 compare Genesis 2:7).And the Lord Jesus refered to "created from the beginning, male and female" - man, created in the beginning: "And He answered and said, Have you not read that He who created [them] from the beginning made them male and female, and said, for this cause shall a man leave his father and his mother and shall be joined to his wife; and the two shall be one flesh"? (Matt.19:4,5)Notice that the phrase "created them from the beginning male and female" is a reference to Genesis 1:27 while the phrase "for this cause shall a man leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his wife" is a reference to Genesis 2:24.Christ combines the two portions of Scripture under the subject matter of humanity created "from the beginning," ie. the first of men and women.I think this would shatter your theory. Christ understood the two portions to refer to man created in the beginning. And Paul confirms that this Adam in Genesis 2:4 is "the first man."Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

An excellent book all on the Tree of Life.Titles A-Z | LSM Online PublicationsEdited by jaywill, : No reason given.