When does design become intelligent? (AS OF 8/2/10 - CLOSING COMMENTS ONLY)

Please show where I mentioned information.

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

None of this has anything to do with the definition of information that you provided. Does that mean that you are abandoning that definition? If so, what's the new one? If not, why the hell are you bringing this stuff in?

But that has been your point this whole time!"Because intelligence is needed, in nature, intellignece is also needed"If this is not your point, and you agree that intelligence is not needed for evolutionary processes, then what the hell haveyou been arguing about this whole time?

Hi Huntard, Do you have a source that I can read of an unguided process taking place in a computer.A process that does not require code to process that process.If you do I would appreciate the source.God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Yup. Still an assumption without evidentiary basis. Don't have one. Nobody does. Nobody knows anything about it. That means that anything that anyone says about it, including you, is making an assumption without an evidentiary basis. And that's still nothing more than assumption that gives you a warm and fuzzy feeling.

---

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. Ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity. It is the mere Abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of Jesus. -- Thomas JeffersonFor we know that our patchwork heritage is a strength, not a weakness. We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and non-believers. -- Barack ObamaWe see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- PhatIt has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate

Hi Dr, Mutations occur.As a random mutation generator proves.It also proves that no valuable information can be added to a sentence or to a single word nor can it change either into something that is useful. Even though you run billions of mutations.A computer does what it is programed to do.If the processor overheats it can write a lot of mutations to a lot of places on the hard drive and can cause a lot of problems. I have never heard of one that created anything useful.A program does what is written in the code.The computer can not think.The computer progam can not mutate.A virus can mutate a program but I have never seen one produce something that was usable.But the virus is created by an intelligent being.God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Hi CS, That would depend of whether the life form was created by an intelligent designer or whether it was created by chaos.If it was created by an intelligent designer it would have the information placed in the life form at the point of creation.If it was created by chaos I have no idea how the information could begin to exist and get in the life form.God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Fortunately life did not come from chaos as you have been shown and the information came from simple chemical processes.For life, no intelligent designer is needed.Edited by jar, : fix sub-title

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Not necessarily... I see no reason to assume the intelligent designer was too inept to employ chaos as a means of creating. Again, not necessarily. I see no reason to assume the same ineptitude that you proscribe to the intelligent designer. It started with just chemical reactions, those happen all on their own. Eventually, you get to self replication, which when imperfect, introduces new information.Its all very, very gradual.

Hi jar, Since we do not have that life form we can not know what it had or did not have.Tell me what chemical reactions can create information. I am sure there was all kinds of chemical reaction taking place for an undetermined existence prior to a life form begining to exist.But since we don't know how that life form began to exist what do those reactions have to do with that life form beginning to exist?There is no evidence that the first life form was caused by chaos or whether it was intelligently designed.The only evidence we have for either is the words of mankind.God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Hi jar, You did mention intelligence and said it was not required.Well all information I am familiar with requires intelligence to begin to exist.Do you have an example of information that does not require intelligence to begin to exist?What is the process that information would go through to begin to exist?God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

You ought to be familiar by now, because you've been told many times, that the information in the structure of a molecule - every molecule - is all it requires to do all of its reactions. All you're doing over and over again is claiming that 2 + 2 = 5.

---

Life is like a Hot Wheels car. Sometimes it goes behind the couch and you can't find it.

Hi Huntard, My point intelligence is required for information to exist.Information is required for DNA to exist.DNA information is required for life to exist.I can find no information that is not created by some intelligent being that requires an intelligent designer/creator or whatever you want to call him/her/she/it for life to exist.Now if you have some information that was not created by some intelligent being or process please present it with the source.God Bless,

---

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

And this program itself is not an intelligent designer, correct?The very most you could argue by trying to make the existence of the programmer part of the simulation (which he is not) is that some sort of intelligent designer would be required to make a universe in which evolution then happened by itself. That would be an analogue to the role played by the programmer. Such a designer would be irrelevant to questions about whether species require intelligent design. No. You can tell that I'm not saying that by the way I said something totally different.Why don't you go back and read what I wrote? And no-one has disputed that. So maybe you could stop saying it now, and address the point actually under discussion.

However the study of Abiogenesis is currently working towards understanding what was possible.All chemical reactions produce information.The results of the reactions contain lots of information.Start with hydrous magnesium iron phyllosilicate and depending on trace minerals and temperature and pressure and time you get asbestos or serpentine or bowintite.Chemical reactions produce information. There is no difference between what happens to create Deoxyribonucleic acid or serpentine. Again, that is simply not true and you have been shown that is not true.While chaos is not suggested in anything I have posted, there is evidence for chemical reactions. There is NO evidence of any Intelligent Designer.

---

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!