Jesus The false prophet

I think I already made the point that church history has been full of inconsistencies and self serving human attitudes. At the same time though, the church has been a force for good in many many cases. Just as the OT Hebrews allowed themselves to be heavily influenced by their pagan neighbours, the church from the time of Jesus on, including the disciples themselves, keeps trying to make God over into their image. Not at all, the first church was in a sense Jesus and His disciples, but in another sense the first church would be when the disciples were empowered by the Holy Spirit.

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Everybody is entitled to my opinion.

so basically what Jesus meant to say was some of you will become "super-heroes" in service of god before you die?Or the kingdom of god has already come you just dont know it yet and NONE of you will taste death before the kingdom comes because i am that kingdom, and i am already here.Would it not be simpler to take the prophecy literally, it says some of you will not die before my father comes and rules the earth.

The book of John is not one of the synoptics and was a much later writing.The book of John does not have that speech by Jesus, so it really doesn't contribute to the discussion.The Bible has many authors and they all don't necessarily have the same audience or purpose.Again I ask:Show me that the synoptic authors presented Jesus as God.
Show me that the apostles thought Jesus was God in the synoptics.You still haven't shown me that Jesus claimed to be presenting a message from God.FYI

So the book of John is wrong and Jesus is not god it do-sent matter what the apostles believed Jesus was. If Jesus is god then he should have known that god was not coming before some taste death. Unless something like my previous reply happened.And if he was considered a prophet any words of prophecy would be taken as that they are coming directly from god. Deuthoromy says it clearly if the prophecy does not come true do not fear the prophet because he does not speak for god. And if he does not speak for god he is no prophet and what else that he said was also not spoken for god but from his own mouth and his own ideas.

According to the passage frako cited, a prophet is only false if they claim to speak false things through God.Did Jesus speak false things through God when he predicted the end times?The things were false.Did he claim to speak them through God?JonEdited by Jon, : / → ?

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Love your enemies!

Was that an attempt to not address the issue?Can you show in any book where Jesus speaks something that he both claims to be from God and that also ends up being false?No one is denying that it might be there; but we do want to see it if it is.Jon

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Love your enemies!

No, just that they would be empowered to serve others. No, it was that Jesus mission was essentially a "Kingdom of God" movement. He fulfilled the Hebrew scriptures but not in the way His contemporaries anticipated. In some ways it was even a political movement with Jesus as the founder if you want to look at it that way. It was of course more than that though. The disciples point is that had happened. The point at the time was very political, because essentially the disciples, after the resurrection were saying that Jesus is King which meant Caesar wasn't. But again rule under Caesar is all about power and control, whereas rule under Jesus is all about love and service.

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Everybody is entitled to my opinion.

Hi frako,The Samaritan woman was amazed at the ability of Jesus to speak concerning the events and conditions of her life. "'Sir, 'I can see that you are a prophet'" (John 4:19).Jesus was the Messiah, God in the flesh. Jesus continues his convo with the woman "The woman said, 'I know that Messiah' (Christ)is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us. Then Jesus said, "I who speak to you am he" (John 4:25-26).Jesus knew everything about everyone and walked in the "office" of a prophet. Jesus is the Head of the Church. The church consists of Prothets, pastors, teachers, Evangelists and apostles to build up the church. It's called the fivefold ministry for the edification of the saints. Jesus, was ALL of these. More importantly he was God. If he was a "false" prophet (im assuming you believe he existed or wouldn't have started a thread about it if he didn't) then you must also believe that the diciples died horrible deaths from following this "false" prophet and remained faithful to him even unto death. Do you think they would have followed a false prophet to the death? Having witnessed so many miracles a false prophet could never do, they believed he was who he said he was.Of course this is all assuming you believe Jesus Christ existed. If you don't believe he existed then this is a moot point. But, if you do believe he existed and based on the Scripture references you gave you must conclude( if you want to use the Bible as evidence against Jesus you must also use it as evidence FOR his existance and any argument made for the case against your comment that proves it otherwise) that Jesus was who he said he was based on the Gospels account of Jesus' calims to who he said he was. You cannot use the Bible to discredit Jesus because it's one continual flow from Genesis to Revelations concerning the -prophecy of his coming-his birth-burial-resurrection -and Ascension. It all flows perfectly from beginning to end.To say Jesus was a false prophet is 1, admiting he existed and 2, that he had followers. If he existed you believe that based on the account of the Bible and can't use the same Bible to discredit him at the same time. Your cancelling out your own opinion with that logic. Good day.

Do you think its logical to assume that when he predicted that the holy kingdom will come before before some of the listeners taste death he was just making it up and not speaking for god. And that the others who listened knew it? I think it is obvious he is trying to put words in gods mouth. Ergo false prophet.Its like saying The commander at nor rad wasn't talking as the commander of norrad when he told the president the Russians are launching nukes you can plainly see that when he deint tell the president i am speaking for the team in norrad. The president was foolish to launch nukes at Russia for that.If you are a prophet then every prophecy you make should be from god there are no loopholes of not having his prophet hat on.Then i can be a prophet tomorrow the end of times will come hey if i miss the date i wast talking from god but im still a prophet its going to happen after tomorrow, and when it finaly happens (the day hell freezes over) i can say see i am a prophet this prophecy came directly from god.

Um lets say an account balance book would show you are a grate dona tor to the poor and at the same time it can show you are an embezzler. Or since the book provides clear evidence you are a good person that donates to the poor that book canot be used to prove that you also embezzle money.I dont care about the other prophecies that where bent over backwards to fit with Jesus, i care about his FALSE PROPHECY

Can you point out the kingdom of love and service to me at anytime in history??Or did his whole prophecy resemble this firecracker anologyIm gonna throw this firecracker now shut your ears its going to be loud *2 seconds later* pft Never knew you need to be empowered by the holy spirit to do soexample: http://www.atheistshelpingthehomeless.org/.../AHTH/index.phpAnd even if it started out that way the whole movement was a dud for the next 1500 years his followers where more concerned with saving their souls by torture is necessary, then helping the needy, and they still dont serve others. Edited by AdminPD, : Fixed quote box

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So the book of John is wrong and Jesus is not god it do-sent matter what the apostles believed Jesus was. If Jesus is god then he should have known that god was not coming before some taste death. Unless something like my previous reply happened.

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Address my argument. This is Bible Study.If you want to say Jesus is God then your claim that Jesus is a false prophet is still wrong. Deuteronomy is a rule from God for men who claim to speak for God, it does not apply to God.As I showed in Luke the Kingdom of God is considered within the person not external. In Acts 2 we see the internal kingdom coming with power. So this author supports the prediction.

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And if he was considered a prophet any words of prophecy would be taken as that they are coming directly from god. Deuthoromy says it clearly if the prophecy does not come true do not fear the prophet because he does not speak for god. And if he does not speak for god he is no prophet and what else that he said was also not spoken for god but from his own mouth and his own ideas.

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Show me support that anything a prophet speaks concerning the future is considered to be from God whether the prophet claims it is from God or not. Just because you believe that doesn't make it so.Deuteronomy says the prophet spoke presumptuously, not that the prophet was a false prophet. The prophet just overstepped his authority. Only when the prophet tries to lead God's people to other gods is he then a false prophet. Deuteronomy doesn't support your contention that Jesus was a false prophet.
The book of John does not support your contention that Jesus was a false prophet.The book of Acts, which is written by the same author as Luke, supports what Jesus said since it considers the kingdom to be within a person.

Do you know how silly this sounds im telling you the end of days its coming but i dint here this form god its my wild guess. If i heare anything about the subject form god i will add the phrase god says next time. How do you know he dint do just that you have the failed prophecy and all of a sudden a new god or new part of god is being worshiped Jesus? You could have been led astray and not even know it.

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Do you know how silly this sounds im telling you the end of days its coming but i dint here this form god its my wild guess. If i heare anything about the subject form god i will add the phrase god says next time.

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IOW, you have no support for your position. I've shown you that the author of Luke tells us that the kingdom of god is within us and people experienced that in the book of Acts.People of the time understood it whether you do or not.

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How do you know he dint do just that you have the failed prophecy and all of a sudden a new god or new part of god is being worshiped Jesus? You could have been led astray and not even know it.

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All we have is what is written. If you have evidence outside the Bible, then please show it. My guess is that you don't.You're simply avoiding the argument.So far you haven't supported your contention that Jesus is a false prophet.

Yea the kingdom of god came with such power inside them that they had to ask where is it.