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Author
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Topic: Religions are fairy tales for adults. Should we encourage them to grow up?
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 138 of 424 (767243)
08-27-2015 11:52 AM
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Reply to: Message 129 by Faith
08-26-2015 7:17 PM
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Faith writes: No, what God said should and did have plenty to do with our justice system, back when it was rational and based on the Ten Commandments.
The problem is that you're not reading the Ten Commandments. An eye for an eye is about compensation, not retribution. That is what perfect justice is about - fixing the problem as much as possible rather than compounding it (as Gandhi said).
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 129 by Faith, posted 08-26-2015 7:17 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Greatest I am writes: Canadians are usually better thinkers.
Thank you. I'm from Saskatchewan.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Greatest I am writes: Your own words say the same thing. "You will know those you love by what you are willing to do for them. You will know who loves you by what they do for you."
Try reading it again. The people you love are not necessarily the people who love you.
Greatest I am writes: Even a parent of a child born in a vegetative state will love his or her child on the assumption that the child would love them back if it could.
Haven't you ever heard of unconditional love?
Greatest I am writes: Vegetative children cannot love so that love cannot be what I describe as true love nor can it fit what you yourself wrote above.
So you're using the No True Scotsman fallacy: it isn't "true" love unless it fits your definition.
Greatest I am writes: I love Shania but with knowing me and feeling the same, I would be stupid to call that true love and would cheapen the meaning the way you are doing.
So you've moved the goalposts from "love" to "true love". You admit you love Shania even though she doesn't know you exist, much less reciprocate. That's what we've been talking about, not the "true love" mumbo-jumbo that you just made up.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Greatest I am writes: Have you seen this on the commandments that Faith likes so much?
I'm on a public library computer, so I can't use the sound. And on principle I don't follow your video links anyway. If you have a point, make it.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Greatest I am writes: My point is that they are garbage.
The Ten Commandments are not garbage. Judaism has come to understand them in a constructive way rather than a destructive way like Faith does.
Greatest I am writes: As to love, like faith according to St. James, you will know them by their works and deeds so love, like faith, have conditions.
Yes, and reciprocity is NOT a condition, either in love or in faith.
Greatest I am writes: That Shania thing was to make a point. I should have perhaps shown that but have never needed to do so to for people to understand.
You need to now. Make your point.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 163 of 424 (767330)
08-28-2015 11:58 AM
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Reply to: Message 152 by Faith
08-27-2015 2:13 PM
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Faith writes: First, obviously Jesus is not talking to state authorities but to His own personal followers.
Jesus' audience had no influence over the Roman emperor. You DO have influence over your elected representatives. You CAN take responsibility where Jesus audience could not.
Faith writes: that an eye for an eye should be the principle that guides the justice system makes sense to me because it is such a perfect statement of justice....
Again, that isn't what the Bible says.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 152 by Faith, posted 08-27-2015 2:13 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 165 by Faith, posted 08-28-2015 12:31 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 166 of 424 (767339)
08-28-2015 12:41 PM
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Reply to: Message 165 by Faith
08-28-2015 12:31 PM
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Faith writes: Are you actually saying that the criminal justice system should turn the other cheek to a criminal?
I'm pointing out what Jesus said. At the very least, you should be advocating against an eye for an eye, not for it. And you keep ignoring the fact that an eye for an eye is NOT about vengeance or even "justice". It's about compensation.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 165 by Faith, posted 08-28-2015 12:31 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 167 by Faith, posted 08-28-2015 1:22 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 197 of 424 (767436)
08-29-2015 11:47 AM
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Reply to: Message 167 by Faith
08-28-2015 1:22 PM
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Faith writes: I merely point out that it's worded in a way that expresses perfect justice.
But it isn't. There's nothing in the wording that suggests perfection. It's about making the best of a bad situation. YOUR view of it has some obvious imperfections. Taking an eye for an eye makes no allowance for errors - you can't un-execute somebody who's wrongfully convicted. And it does nothing to compensate the victim. So no, not "perfect" by any stretch of the imagination.
Faith writes: Jesus came for a completely different purpose than to tell states how to run their criminal justice system.
He talked about an eye for an eye in the same breath as turning the other cheek. He clearly considered the two systems to be parallel.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 167 by Faith, posted 08-28-2015 1:22 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 198 of 424 (767437)
08-29-2015 12:01 PM
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Reply to: Message 194 by Phat
08-29-2015 10:03 AM
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Re: Origin Of Evil
Phat writes: There is no evil in heaven. A war was fought and evil got thrown out.
Sounds like an infomercial: "Removes stains INSTANTLY!" The product is seldom as perfect as the hype.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 194 by Phat, posted 08-29-2015 10:03 AM | | Phat has seen this message but not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 202 of 424 (767453)
08-29-2015 1:23 PM
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Reply to: Message 201 by Faith
08-29-2015 1:21 PM
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Re: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: There is no problem with heathen marriages.
So idolatry, which is specified in the Ten Commandments, is okay but homosexuality, which is not specified in the Ten Commandments, is not? Curiouser and curiouser.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 201 by Faith, posted 08-29-2015 1:21 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 205 by Faith, posted 08-29-2015 1:28 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 222 of 424 (767539)
08-30-2015 2:08 PM
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Reply to: Message 205 by Faith
08-29-2015 1:28 PM
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Re: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: Homosexuality is condemned under Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery.
No, homosexuality falls under the same category as eating shellfish and wearing cotton-polyester blends.
Faith writes: I guess you've never heard a good sermon series on the Ten Commandments.
There's your problem again: putting all your faith into sermons and commentaries instead of actually READING the Bible.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 205 by Faith, posted 08-29-2015 1:28 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 223 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 2:23 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 224 of 424 (767544)
08-30-2015 2:27 PM
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Reply to: Message 223 by Faith
08-30-2015 2:23 PM
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Re: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: If you read some commentaries you might not say such ****** things about the Bible.
If you would read the Bible, you wouldn't need to rely on your ****** commentaries.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 223 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 2:23 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 229 of 424 (767562)
08-30-2015 3:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 227 by Faith
08-30-2015 3:43 PM
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Re: HRe: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: I don't want to be complicit in the state's giving the license either.
But you don't mind being complicit in the state's executing somebody who is wrongfully convicted?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 227 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 3:43 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 230 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 3:50 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 231 of 424 (767564)
08-30-2015 3:50 PM
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Reply to: Message 228 by Faith
08-30-2015 3:45 PM
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Re: HRe: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: The problem with giving the Lord's word on homosexuality is that people are already confused about what this problem is about.
The problem is that the Bible doesn't say what you want it to say - so you have to cherry-pick.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 228 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 3:45 PM | | Faith has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 233 of 424 (767568)
08-30-2015 3:57 PM
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Reply to: Message 232 by Faith
08-30-2015 3:51 PM
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Re: HRe: Clerk refuses to issue marriage license to gays
Faith writes: You should be bound and gagged so you can't tell lies.
If you can point out any lies or even errors in my posts, feel free to do so.[/qs]
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 232 by Faith, posted 08-30-2015 3:51 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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