Creation DOES need to be taught with evolution

They don't have to verify/falsify any theory, just teach the idea.
I do realize that is why they are taught there, but creation should still BE MENTIONED in science class!

I think that you don't understand what Brian is asking. Falsification is a crucial component of any scientific theory. Even evolution is falsifiable. "Falsifiable" doesn't mean it's false, it means that there's a situation where we could know that the theory is false. For instance if you had a theory that your sister ate all the cookies, a potential falsification for this would be you knowing that it was you who ate the cookies.But when you say that "God made everything we see in such a way as to fool us into thinking he didn't" that isn't falsifiable. There's no situation where you couldn'tadvance that as a theory.No falsification = no science. Evolution is falsifiable. Creationism is not. It's a fairy tale that tries to explain everything, and winds up explaining nothing. (For instance you might tell us what technological advances have been made possible as a result of creationist theories.) Why? It's just not science!

Then all possibilities should be put in a Origin Theory Class, or something like that. Since, you say it is 'not science'.

We've got that, at least at college. It's called "Comparitive World Religions." You'll notice that it's not offered by the Bio department.

But science classes are for theories that can be tested and retested, that is what science is all about. Why do they do experiments in science classes? They want to show the students how an 'idea' became a theory.In high schools science classes are only allowed a certain percentage of time in the curriculum, they have enough work to get through without wasting time on fairytales that have nothing to do with science. These creation myths were written by a society that was prescientific, they contain no science.I know you mean well, and fair dues to you, but creation isnt scientific.Brian.

I said a few religous theories for a SHORT amount of time - just mentioning them would eliminate the need for an aditional class.Also what I'm saing about the Origin Theory Class is all theories of where we came from could be in it - including evolution.
Yes I know evolution is a fact but humans coming from evolution IS NOT A FACT.[This message has been edited by TruthDetector, 01-18-2004]

Oh, well, my daughter's text mentioned, in a sidebar, that people used to think that living things were all formed at once but that is now understood to be wrong. (something to that effect -- I could find the exact quote if she has the text here).That's about the correct history in a nutshell.

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Common sense isn't

I think Creation is impossible to teach in schools because the teacher would surely be ridiculed. I mean how can you explain it to a group of young, intelligent adults without sounding ridiculous. You may get away with it if the pupils were infants, say between 5 and 8. The current theories may not be perfect but on the whole they are plausible and believeable.

Hi, I don't want to keep trying to pick faults with your opinions but you need to think about what you are saying here.First, there are no scientific theories of creation, these are not theories since they cannot be falsified. To need to remember that science has to put forward a hypothesis that can be tested for reliability, if the hypothesis is the best available for the evidence at hand then it will become a theory, theories are built around observable facts. Creation stories have no way of being proven incorrect. Try it yourself, how can anyone prove that the creatin story in Genesis one be proven false? There is no way to do it. This is why it is Religious Studies classes and not science, it is a belief that has no scientific support. But what are the theories of creation? There are none that I am aware of. When you start saying 'God did it' then you are outside the realm of science.I actually think most kids are aware of the Adam and Eve story, I also think that they know it is a religious belief that can be found in the Bible.Are you aware of any science classes at sunday schools that teach the scientific theory of creation?Let us cut to the chase. Why do you think creation is only taught in Religious Studies classes? Do you think it found its way into the Religious Studies curriculum by accident?Brian.

Hiya,I dont think it is so much that the teacher will one ridiculed but the science teacher has a degree in science. To teach creation in science classes would mean retraining science teachers in philosophy and religion, and not just one religion either as many creation stories are taught in school RE classes.Once the science teacher has taught about Adam and Eve, or Purusha, or even Pan Ku, they would then have to say which creation story is accurate as these myths vary greatly in detail. As these are religious beliefs it is impossible to prove any of them wrong (or right)Science teachers have a heavy enough work load without asking them to take on any extra study that is ultimately pointless.Brian.

David Fitch,After studying the natural history of humans for 40 years, I find the best reason why creation science should not be taught in schools is this:My Dad used to say that a scoop of ice cream on a pile of manure does little to improve the pile of manure. Just a waste of ice cream. But a dip of manure on a dish of ice cream ruins it.Now, human beings are not designed to learn in schools. Schools for humans is a shitty idea. Humans are designed (you'd probably say, "adapted") to be taught by apprenticeship, in family settings. Schools are for fish, to get them to go with the group. As such, the placing of children in schools to be educated is just a very cruel and dirty trick, apt to make any lively young humans madder than hell and disinclined to trust anything else the scoundrels who run the place are likely to say. It would be a shame to place something as precious and wonderful as the story of creation in such a foul pit of despair.I once found a course in graduate school that I found useful. I dropped it immediately, although I went to all the classes and took the exams. By cutting out the grades and credit, and spending a lot of time with my major professor, I managed to actually learn something there without losing my mind.Meanwhile, I watch (cringing) the results of evolutionary teaching in school on the minds of the debaters here that want so desparately to believe that science actually supports the theory's plausibility. Who taught these people how to think? Those teachers ought to be taken out and horse-whipped!Stephen

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Meanwhile, I watch (cringing) the results of evolutionary teaching in school on the minds of the debaters here that want so desparately to believe that science actually supports the theory's plausibility. Who taught these people how to think? Those teachers ought to be taken out and horse-whipped!

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Excuse me if I'm confusing you with someone else, but aren't you the one who keeps bringing up Bible codes?

Chiroptera,You ask, Yep. Bible Codes research is one of the best example of careful use of statistics in science I know. And the Codes controversy is a model, actually for the abusive way paradigm shifting research is treated by the defenders of the faith type scientists described by Kuhn. The code critics will find the same place in history as those disgusting individuals who found Semmelweis' studies on hand-washing in hospitals "flawed". And kept on delivering babies with hands soiled from autopsies. And kept on killing 25% of mothers delivering babies in hospitals. For 70 years.If hell doesn't exist, I'll be disappointed.Stephen

Yep, you are right because prior to education for the masses the only schooling that the general Christian population got was in sunday school. I guess that explains why scientists have such a difficult time. Thanks for the clarification. So, the grades and credit are the "...very cruel and dirty trick..."?? I don't think so. Basically, you employed a common psychological technique to de-stress a situation by deluding yourself into thinking the class "didn't matter".

Tagless,I agree that public schools are an improvement on Sunday Schools. Precisely because they (public schools) leave the good stuff for walks with Dad to the fishing hole.Stephen