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Author Topic:   What religious rights, if any, are currently being eroded in the USA?
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 228 (103165)
04-27-2004 6:57 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by Sylas
04-27-2004 1:46 AM


quote:
In my view, the erosion of rights of minority religions is MORE likely if one particular religion is given any special status or influence.
As is evidenced by the Puritans moving to the American colonies from England to avoid religious persecution by the Church of England. The US was founded on religious freedom, not government endorsement of specific religions (as I am sure you are very aware of).
quote:
Constitutional constraints on establishment of religion are a necessary (but not sufficient) condition for reliable protection of religious rights.
Very true. Societal pressures are outside the Constitutions reach. The Constitution is a stop gap between societal pressures and the implementation of law. An Establishment Clause might not prevent social persecution, but it helps to prevent government persecution, as well as encourage government protection of minority opinions. What I see in America right now is people ignoring this fact, that the Constitution is there to protect the minority at the expense of limiting the majority. Somehow "but most of us believe in this" is suddenly a sufficient argument for guiding the formation of law.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by Sylas, posted 04-27-2004 1:46 AM Sylas has not replied

  
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 131 of 228 (105670)
05-05-2004 6:24 PM
Reply to: Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object
05-05-2004 6:11 PM


quote:
Yes, Jesus said to sell all that you have and give the money to the poor.
Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but didn't Jesus say "give unto Caesar what is Caesar's"? This seems to directly address the issue of taxes as it applies to christians. Jesus seems to indicate that christians are to give to the state what the state demands. Nowhere do I see Jesus saying that the church should have special tax status.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-05-2004 6:11 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-05-2004 7:29 PM Loudmouth has replied

  
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 138 of 228 (105945)
05-06-2004 12:32 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by Cold Foreign Object
05-05-2004 7:29 PM


quote:
Who determines what belongs to Caesar ?
Caesar.
quote:
Jesus didn't say to give to Caesar whatever he demands. His answer is ambiguous enough to not make conclusions like yours.
Not at all. Here is Matthew 22:15-22 (NIV)
15Then the Pharisees went out and laid plans to trap him in his words. 16They sent their disciples to him along with the Herodians. "Teacher," they said, "we know you are a man of integrity and that you teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. You aren't swayed by men, because you pay no attention to who they are. 17Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or not?"
18But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, "You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? 19Show me the coin used for paying the tax." They brought him a denarius, 20and he asked them, "Whose portrait is this? And whose inscription?"
21"Caesar's," they replied.
Then he said to them, "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's."
22When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away.
It seems you are trying to trap us like the Pharisee's tried to trap Jesus. Jesus very clearly states that if it is the state's money, the state controls it.
This message has been edited by Loudmouth, 05-06-2004 11:33 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-05-2004 7:29 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-06-2004 5:35 PM Loudmouth has replied

  
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 141 of 228 (106026)
05-06-2004 5:54 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Cold Foreign Object
05-06-2004 5:35 PM


quote:
Your conclusion is called rhetoric, which is the misuse of logic to support an assertion.
Do you know what the definition of irony is?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-06-2004 5:35 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 05-06-2004 6:12 PM Loudmouth has not replied

  
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