Church History In Plain Language (5th edition)

Now we've got a conversation going! So you *do* recognize my standards. Christians are ideally NOT Warlords, correct? Have they been? Are any of them? The United Nations is/was a precursor to a One World governing body. And yet Russia is a permanent member of the UN security council.
In the tribute thread, you brought up a nostalgic picture of Sin'ead O'Connor bashing Pope John Paul II. "The real evil". By your standards, he was not Christian. And yet you do recognize a standard because you chastised me! I was proud of the fact that you defended Christianity by scolding me for not being more Christian.Russia and China are now allies and yet both sit on the UN Security Council. So back to Taiwan. We condemned Vladimir Putin and John Paul II. What about Xi? Can we resolve Taiwan peacefully without sinking anybody's boat?The UN Security council has everyone at the table. So why is there war in Ukraine and why are some of us feeding guns and knives and bombs into it and why are dead babies coming out of it?Will we (as in we the people of the planet) do anything better in negotiations regarding Taiwan?

Not at all. I deplored that picture that AZ posted. Religion *is* evil. Relationship with Jesus Christ is not. I felt an antichrist spirit when I saw IT. Sin'ead O'Connor would have ripped that picture to shreds! The War in Ukraine is accelerating the speed of climate change and causing harm to everyone...yet Russia *is* wrong! Ukraine does have a right to exist and initially refused to be bullied. Zelensky became Time Magazine Man Of The Year. And yet even AZPaul the antitheist chided me for acting unchristian! Hopefully the world can stop acting unchristian and resolve these conflicts peacefully.

Reading this book was in fact research. Its certainly far better than listening to an atheist critic like Richard Carrier!We will get around to discussing the book. Bruce Shelley certainly does not see early Christianity through rose colored glasses. If by that you mean Vladimir Putin you are correct. It would be nice to get honest dialogue between him, Zelensky, and perhaps Biden or Anthony Blinken. Keep in mind that he distrusts the West (and may have been referring to Zelensky as the Jewish element that was complicating annexation within Ukraine)Percy mentions Israel as a "religious bad actor" but I will tell you that Israel has a more powerful military than either Iran or Russia ever thought of having. One problem in the Middle East is that Saudi Arabia is starting to cozy up to China over the United States which is one reason why the US Dollars best days are behind it. You dont tell your trading partner that you are going green overnight and cause them to question the petro dollars future value to them.

No international organization should be the police. The early Popes were in competition with secular rulers themselves for power over the state. The early church as described in the Bible never fought itself. From what I read, Jesus Himself never desired to be the king of this world nor did He advocate fighting Rome itself. If you want to see fireworks, imagine a day when the UN opposes the United States! Global consensus does not necessarily equal legitimacy.In Shelleys book, the early church (after Acts but before Constantine) became progressively more compromising. If everyone agrees, I will start discussing the book specifically.

OK, I'll take that as constructive criticism. What I mean though is that we all should fear the day that the UN has the muscle to stop the US from doing what it wants.

I think that Democracy is the only path to legitimacy.

I do not support secular humanism. The main reason is the anti religious stance.I support a Christian Democracy, if such a thing is possible.How often do I have to remind you that I have never voted for Trump no do I intend to.I do resist the efforts of those who seek freedom from religion. They are not believers.I think that I prefer a open and public relationship with Jesus rather than a Falwell styled "Majority". Church and State should be seperate but Jesus should by no means be kept out of government or legal justice, if He in fact resides within some of us.any sort of PRIDE should be pride in our relationship with Jesus and should be freely and openly expressed.

While I admit to some ignorance in my life, I never try and actually hate anyone.I've been listening to this Church History on my audible over and over and I still have a lot of questions about it. Do you want to discuss it? I was assuming that Trump was the Elephant
Fascist in the room. I dont think that the Right Wing in general is fascist, though it could be debatable.Lets focus on Christianity as it bumps up against the Enlightenment, Critical Thinking, and Humanism.