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Author Topic:   Acceptance, Evolutionists vs. Creationists
custard
Inactive Member


Message 51 of 134 (113178)
06-07-2004 3:50 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by jar
06-05-2004 10:51 PM


Re: I think you go too far there.
christianity as a whole is a very manipulative and controlling religion. it literally teaches people to be sheep. they are taught to accept authority in an almost brainwashed fashion.
Jar responds:
It is not Christianity that teaches abject acceptance of authority, but rather some of the more perverted communities, those holding beliefs that cannot stand up to challenge.
Jar raises a good point which I think it is easy to lose sight of: it's easy to blame lack of critical thinking on religion, but the root cause goes so much deeper than Christianity, or any other religion.
Think about it. How many people do you know who are not creationists (which is everyone I know except one friend) but who believe in one or more of the following: UFOs, homeopathic 'medicine,' psychics, ESP, tarot cards, astrology, George Bush propaganda, Michael Moore propaganda, JFK conspiracies, conspiracy theories in general, TM, Feng Shue, Acupuncture, Dowsing, etc. etc.
Most people I know believe in one or more or at least do not doubt the possibility of their existence. How many of your friends/acquaintences would consider themselves valid thinkers yet still espouse one of the things I listed? Not a valid sample set? True, but telling nonetheless. Better examples are how popular and prevelant books, shows, and movies about the aforementioned subject matter are.
A great example is how popular homeopathic medicine has become despite the fact all you are buying is a placebo. Even some health care insurance providers are allowing some forms of 'alternative medicine' to be covered by medical insurance.
Heck, even think about your typical US highschool experience, how many of us were really, truly encouraged to challenge what we were taught in chemistry, biology, or physics? It's hard to challenge things when you:
1- don't know much about the subject (e.g. most creationists (or laypeople) really don't understand evolution).
2- have authorities you respect teaching you and reinforcing what you have been taught is true.
3- have an inherent bias because you want to believe it is true.
4- the subject is constantly in print, telivision, or media in general and it doesn't critically question your position.
I honestly believe many, if not most people are not critical thinkers
but not simply because they have been exposed to Christianity (look at how many of the forum participants have "I used to be Christian" stories).
That said, I do agree that passionate religious communities bend over backwards to obfuscate or warp reality to fit their desired vision of the world. Joseph Smith saw invisible golden tablets? L. Ron Hubbard knew about extraterrestrial intelligence? Noah crammed a bunch of critters in a wooden boat for months?
I will never forget how my grandparents explained dinosaur fossils away as Satanic tricks intended to make the righteous stray from the path.
But I also think with enough exposure to difficult questions, people can become critical thinkers. If tough questions are presented, or even encouraged, I think some of it has to start rubbing off. A seed is planted. Isn't this similar to the conversion process in a way? All that witnessing and Good News spreading bombards folks with questions they can't answer then provide them with answers from God?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by jar, posted 06-05-2004 10:51 PM jar has not replied

  
custard
Inactive Member


Message 52 of 134 (113180)
06-07-2004 4:01 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by jar
06-06-2004 1:02 AM


Semi-off topic anecdote
Jar responds to Almeyda:
The fact that so many Christians also understand that Evolution happened and that Creationism is simply howling at the moon, shows your conjecture is not true.
This reminds me of an interesting conversation I recently had with my one and only friend who is a creationist (but whom I strongly suspect is wavering bit by bit).
We had both taken two years of biology in school (same classes in fact) and I was lamenting how woefully lacking our education in evolutionary theory had been: a picture of the Lamarckian giraffes juxtaposed with a picture of Darwin with the captions "Darwin was right and Lamarck was wrong."
My friend responded that evolution was really a small part of all of the science of biology and I wondered aloud why there is so much controversy about it. Then I immediately realized that there really isn't any controversy, at least not in the scientific community. Evolution is just another fact, a building block of the foundation of science that everyone accepts (like gravity) and they move on from there.
The only reason I thought it was an issue is because the creationists keep howling so loudly at the moon, that it seemingly creates a debate where there isn't one. Arguing evolution with a creationist really is like arguing heliocentric theory with a member of the flat earth society. It's that whacky.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by jar, posted 06-06-2004 1:02 AM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by crashfrog, posted 06-07-2004 4:41 AM custard has replied

  
custard
Inactive Member


Message 54 of 134 (113204)
06-07-2004 5:55 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by crashfrog
06-07-2004 4:41 AM


Crashfrog writes:
You only have one friend?
Two. I had forgotten about you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by crashfrog, posted 06-07-2004 4:41 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
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