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Author
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Topic: Open letter to all Atheists.
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faceman
Member (Idle past 3414 days) Posts: 149 From: MN, USA Joined: 04-25-2014
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Message 61 of 235 (726174)
05-06-2014 10:02 PM
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Reply to: Message 55 by subbie
05-06-2014 7:26 PM
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Good thing I didn't make that foolish choice then.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 55 by subbie, posted 05-06-2014 7:26 PM | | subbie has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 68 by subbie, posted 05-06-2014 10:37 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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faceman
Member (Idle past 3414 days) Posts: 149 From: MN, USA Joined: 04-25-2014
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Message 62 of 235 (726175)
05-06-2014 10:14 PM
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Reply to: Message 59 by nwr
05-06-2014 10:01 PM
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Nonsense. What does logic have to do with materialism, anyway? Absolutely nothing and that's my point. Materialism can only deal in the natural, not the supernatural. Logic, on the other hand, is immaterial. You can't hold it, it has no atomic weight, it hasn't evolved over billions of years - and yet the laws of logic are universal and absolutely nothing can violate them. How can the atheist worldview (which must incorporate evolution) account for the existence of logic? My point is - if atheism/evolution were true, then logic would be constantly changing and evolving. Thus 2 + 2 could one day equal 5.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 59 by nwr, posted 05-06-2014 10:01 PM | | nwr has replied |
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faceman
Member (Idle past 3414 days) Posts: 149 From: MN, USA Joined: 04-25-2014
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Message 63 of 235 (726176)
05-06-2014 10:16 PM
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Reply to: Message 60 by AZPaul3
05-06-2014 10:01 PM
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Sorry, did I miss Dr. Adequate's question somewhere?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 60 by AZPaul3, posted 05-06-2014 10:01 PM | | AZPaul3 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 67 by AZPaul3, posted 05-06-2014 10:33 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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DrJones*
Member Posts: 2290 From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Joined: 08-19-2004 Member Rating: 6.9
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Message 64 of 235 (726177)
05-06-2014 10:20 PM
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Reply to: Message 62 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:14 PM
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quote:
if atheism/evolution were true, then logic would be constantly changing and evolving.
a: Atheism and evolution are not the same thing 2: Logic is not a biological system and therefore can't evolve
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 62 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:14 PM | | faceman has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 74 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 11:39 PM | | DrJones* has not replied |
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 313 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 65 of 235 (726178)
05-06-2014 10:27 PM
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Reply to: Message 57 by faceman
05-06-2014 9:53 PM
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Does evolution leave room for a supernatural Creator? Obviously.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 57 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 9:53 PM | | faceman has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 77 by faceman, posted 05-07-2014 12:11 AM | | Dr Adequate has replied |
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 313 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 66 of 235 (726179)
05-06-2014 10:29 PM
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Reply to: Message 62 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:14 PM
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if atheism/evolution were true, then logic would be constantly changing and evolving. That may be the wildest non sequitur ever. You'll be the envy of all the other creationists.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 62 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:14 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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AZPaul3
Member Posts: 8563 From: Phoenix Joined: 11-06-2006 Member Rating: 4.7
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Message 67 of 235 (726180)
05-06-2014 10:33 PM
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Reply to: Message 63 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:16 PM
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Sorry, did I miss Dr. Adequate's question somewhere? Apparently, you missed your own question.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 63 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:16 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1283 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: 02-26-2006
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Message 68 of 235 (726182)
05-06-2014 10:37 PM
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Reply to: Message 61 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:02 PM
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faceman writes: Good thing I didn't make that foolish choice then. Your behavior in this thread belies that statement, unless you are attempting to create some sort of Colbert-like parody persona. If that is the case, you are failing miserably to this point.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 61 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:02 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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NoNukes
Inactive Member
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Message 69 of 235 (726183)
05-06-2014 10:42 PM
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Reply to: Message 58 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:01 PM
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Re: My way or atheism
No, I'm almost certain that's not what they all believe. There are some Christians who believe in evolution, though I'm not sure how they sell themselves on that. The point is that right or wrong, none of those people are atheists. So evolution is not atheism.
Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 58 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:01 PM | | faceman has not replied |
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nwr
Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: 08-08-2005 Member Rating: 4.5
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Message 70 of 235 (726185)
05-06-2014 10:53 PM
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Reply to: Message 62 by faceman
05-06-2014 10:14 PM
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How can the atheist worldview (which must incorporate evolution) account for the existence of logic?
Logic is a human construct. Where's the problem?
Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 62 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 10:14 PM | | faceman has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 79 by faceman, posted 05-07-2014 12:22 AM | | nwr has replied |
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riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 445 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: 05-09-2004
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This was an open letter to Atheists who are offended by prayer. Are you? This was not an open letter against logical arguments against prayer, see the difference? But everyone assumes I am some bible toten sob, and that's where the name calling is. There's a lot of good points in this thread, and a lot of bad ones. Regardless, being offended by prayer offends me and IS hylocritcal. Edited by riVeRraT, : No reason given.
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NoNukes
Inactive Member
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Message 72 of 235 (726187)
05-06-2014 11:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 52 by faceman
05-06-2014 6:18 PM
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Your argument started off on a logical footing.
A blue sky is something we can observe just about every day, so she's no more teaching atheism then if she were to proclaim up is up and down is down. Or that true is true and false is false. And then the inevitable non sequitur. I wonder whether you or Blue will give in first and actually post a complete argument.
But then, we can't observe that like we can the blue sky, so we would then know that Jack don't know Jack. We cannot observe you either, so you never happened? Or is it okay to use less direct evidence to decide that some is making your posts.
Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 52 by faceman, posted 05-06-2014 6:18 PM | | faceman has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 82 by faceman, posted 05-07-2014 12:35 AM | | NoNukes has not replied |
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 313 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 73 of 235 (726189)
05-06-2014 11:30 PM
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Reply to: Message 71 by riVeRraT
05-06-2014 11:10 PM
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This was an open letter to Atheists who are offended by prayer. And yet the title of the thread was "Open letter to all Atheists."
Regardless, being offended by prayer offends me and IS hylocritcal. As no-one has expressed that view, it would be hard to demonstrate that such a person is a hypocrite. I can hardly think what form such hypocrisy would take --- someone who declares prayer offensive, perhaps, and then does a little genuflecting in private, sacrifices a few goats? It's not very likely, is it?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 71 by riVeRraT, posted 05-06-2014 11:10 PM | | riVeRraT has not replied |
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faceman
Member (Idle past 3414 days) Posts: 149 From: MN, USA Joined: 04-25-2014
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Message 74 of 235 (726190)
05-06-2014 11:39 PM
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Reply to: Message 64 by DrJones*
05-06-2014 10:20 PM
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I agree with you, on both a: and 2:. My point regarding "atheist/evolution" is that they're both inseparable. I know there are christian evolutionists out there, but you'll probably not find an atheistic creationist any time soon.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 64 by DrJones*, posted 05-06-2014 10:20 PM | | DrJones* has not replied |
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1283 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: 02-26-2006
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Message 75 of 235 (726191)
05-06-2014 11:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 71 by riVeRraT
05-06-2014 11:10 PM
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riverrat writes: This was an open letter to Atheists who are offended by prayer. Are you? I think you will find, if you bother to ask, that very few atheists are offended by prayer, so long as that prayer is not government sponsored or supported in any way.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 71 by riVeRraT, posted 05-06-2014 11:10 PM | | riVeRraT has not replied |
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