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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Fake polls, fake news | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yes I knew I quoted him on some subject or other because his site came up showing quite a bit of information about it.
Thanks for the response but of course I still need some examples of his supposed stupidity, and I don't know why you would think "a broad consensus" of opinion that turns up on Google would impress me. I do happen to know that "Media Matters" is definitely not to be trusted, although I have to say I can't remember why. Owned by Soros or something like that I think. I may make an effort to find out more about both sites eventually, but if I have to choose between the two as a likely source of a trustworthy perspective, without knowing much about either, I'll definitely choose Gateway. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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JonF Member (Idle past 197 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
Media matters is not owned by Soros. Nor is being owned by Soros evidence of perfidy.
If I post examples of Hoft's lies and nutty theories and jumping on any rumor without any checking, will you attempt to prove him correct with objective evidence, or will you rail against whatever bogeymen are on your mind?
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
A summary, with links to examples:
Encyclopedia of American Loons: #769: Jim Hoft Yes, that is a bare link for potential further reading. For material from a former conservative (actually still is, but not the wing-nut variety), I present to you Charles Johnson and his blog "Little Green Footballs".
quote: Charles was a staunch Republican until he decided "The American right wing has gone off the rails, into the bushes, and off the cliff. I won’t be going over the cliff with them." Charles is certainly not a liberal, but he is very down on modern conservatism. And he gives a lot of attention to Jim Hoft and often uses variations of the phrase "Jim Hoft, Stupidest Man on the Internet". Little Green Footballs: Jim Hoft or in a little bit different form lgf: search "DERP Yes, Jim Hoft truly is the Stupidest Man on the Internet. There's really no one else even close in the crowded field of dim-witted right wing derpitude." - Charles Johnson Moose ps: Topics related to the "Killian documents":
Where Was W Waldo? so Bush isn't a liar? Edited by Minnemooseus, : Added Dan Rather related quote from Wikipedia, and other tweaks. Edited by Minnemooseus, : Screwed up a quote box and didn't bother previewing. Edited by Minnemooseus, : ps links and another format tweak.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I'd suppose I'll either think you made your case or you didn't.
As I recall the problem with Media Matters is that it's owned by a full-bore lefty of some sort. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Reading your link has led me to the conclusion that he's taken a strong turn to the left, actually accusing people on the right of the same stuff the left does, basically politically correct lies.
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0
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In regards to Charles Johnson/Little Green Footballs, Faith writes: Reading your link has led me to the conclusion that he's taken a strong turn to the left, actually accusing people on the right of the same stuff the left does, basically politically correct lies. Previously cited, and quoted a little, but here is the entire article (posted 11/30/09):
Charles Johnson - Why I Parted Ways With The Right quote: Yes, "he's taken a strong turn to the left", away from the ultra-right wing wacko fringe. Stated differently, the Republican party's taken a strong turn to the far right, and he was no longer willing to follow. And he does think that Jim Hoft is the dumbest man on the internet. Charles Johnson is still a conservative. It just doesn't look that way because much of his output is critical of the far right lunatic fringe. And Faith, it sure seems that you're part of that lunatic fringe. Moose
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Most of his list misrepresents the right. Just the usual lefty list of false PC accusations.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1434 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I can read that only marginally more easily than the white version but I get the gist of it. ... Is this better?
... I don't know why you'd think a chart like that would mean much to me. ... I thought you might like to know what the rest of the world thinks about how usable the various news sources are considered to be.
... Perhaps the basic scheme is accurate enough, but what matters to me is which ones are trustworthy, and the MSM definitely are not, or those on the liberal side of center. ... And yet InforWars is at the bottom (sensational, click-bait, little fact checking) right (Conservative Utter GarbageConspiracy Theories, cherry picking info and making stuff up). Red State, the Daily Caller, Breitbart, The Blaze, not much better. These are all news sources that gas-light you to believing an extreme right wing agenda. Personally I think #FauxNoiseNutwerk should be down a row or down with the Blaze, and that their idea of "fair and balanced is to give equal weight to those to their right as to all those to their left. And MSNBC should be dropped a row or two (too corporatist).
... Those are the "fake news" from my point of view.. The fake news attack on Trump is understood by his supporters to BE the fake news. My opinion is that all those in the bottom 3 rows are to varying degrees "fake" news, especially when they repeat stories from the lower rows.
The MSM is the fake news. They are trying to get some of our favorite sources banned of course because they don't believe in free speech unless it's their free speech, so they can continue to twist information about Trump without being bothered by those of us who see through them. Horse-pucky. I bet your sources are the ones claiming to being banned and they want you to help them fight back ... I've seen these "reports" -- they are click bait to raise money.
Rather than liberal and conservative news sources these days should be categorized as fake news or not, as I've laid out above. All news should be subject to fact checking no matter the program. We don't have journalists anymore, but infotainment pushers. That's why fact checking sites are becoming more important than the news programs.
PolitifactFactCheck Snopes UrbanLegend Facts don't have bias or an agenda. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined:
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Yes, that chart is perfect, thanks. You're awfully good at that sort of thing.
It's good for comparing how we think about these things at least. I can certainly say that what on the chart is called Mainstream, Minimal Bias, is definitely liberal/leftist from my point of view, none of them only "minimally" biased, though probably some are better than others. I would be hard pressed to distinguish their perspective from the column to the left. I've learned to distrust all of them over the last few decades, though they have all become what I regard as fake news since Trump was elected, or during his campaign for that matter. I think it's absolutely appalling how they treat him. Oh, and your "fact checkers" lean left too; they are certainly not consistently neutral. Depends on the political context of the issue. I'm not sure Infowars deserves to be dismissed as not checking facts. I think it's more likely that they are right about things those to the left of them refuse to consider, and that eventually they will be shown to have been right. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1434 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Yes, that chart is perfect, thanks. You're awfully good at that sort of thing. Thanks.
It's good for comparing how we think about these things at least. I can certainly say that what on the chart is called Mainstream, Minimal Bias, is definitely liberal/leftist from my point of view, none of them only "minimally" biased, though probably some are better than others. I would be hard pressed to distinguish their perspective from the column to the left. I've learned to distrust all of them over the last few decades, though they have all become what I regard as fake news since Trump was elected, or during his campaign for that matter. I think it's absolutely appalling how they treat him. Oh, and your "fact checkers" lean left too; they are certainly not consistently neutral. Depends on the political context of the issue. That's because you are to the extreme far right, the last column. Heck you even invent your own conspiracy theories (like Trump being treated badly -- you don't realize how you are being gas-lighted by him). When you stand in the last column to the right then everything else (including the whole world) is "leftist" in your (imho) under informed opinion. If there is nobody to the right of you Faith, you are at the extreme right edge. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
double post
Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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If there is nobody to the right of you Faith, you are at the extreme right edge. You’re sat on the North Pole Faith, everybody else is South of you - it doesn't matter which direction you look in. Everybody else is a goddamn liberal.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1434 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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You’re sat on the North Pole Faith, everybody else is South of you - it doesn't matter which direction you look in. Everybody else is a goddamn liberal. Yeah, but you can see the spin ... by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
It's good for comparing how we think about these things at least. I can certainly say that what on the chart is called Mainstream, Minimal Bias, is definitely liberal/leftist from my point of view, none of them only "minimally" biased, though probably some are better than others. I would be hard pressed to distinguish their perspective from the column to the left. I've learned to distrust all of them over the last few decades, though they have all become what I regard as fake news since Trump was elected, or during his campaign for that matter. I think it's absolutely appalling how they treat him. Oh, and your "fact checkers" lean left too; they are certainly not consistently neutral. Depends on the political context of the issue. That's because you are to the extreme far right, the last column. Um, I think it's more likely that leftist thinking has managed to get itself accepted as mainstream over the last few decades. It shouldn't be too hard simply to define a leftist idea as versus a conservative idea and see that they align with my view of the chart better than yours. But it's more than just a difference of political views these days, it's the active smear campaign against Trump that's become the problem.
-Heck you even invent your own conspiracy theories (like Trump being treated badly -- you don't realize how you are being gas-lighted by him). How Trump is treated by the MSM/left is certainly not something I made up, I see the evidence in headlines every time I go online, and I'm just one of a huge crowd that recognizes what the "fake news" sources are doing, that's why so many call them fake news.
When you stand in the last column to the right then everything else (including the whole world) is "leftist" in your (imho) under informed opinion. If there is nobody to the right of you Faith, you are at the extreme right edge. I'm probably farther right than a lot of conservatives -- which I attribute to my Christian perspective which a lot of conservatives don't share, but nevertheless I'd put the Mainstream/Center no more than one column to the left of me. What may or may not be to the right of me I'd have to sort out idea by idea.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
By the way, I recall taking one of those quizzes here a few years ago, or more than one maybe, that places you somewhere in a quadrant on a graph according to your political views, and I always end up very near the center, maybe in a Rightist quadrant but not far into it.
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