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Author
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Topic: Another one that hurts
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Helping The Brethren
Dr Adequate writes: ringo writes: It isn't unusual for people with education and money to want to help their brethren who are poor and beaten down.
They're the ones who are doing the beating down. Literally. As for people being poor, the people in this refugee camp have not undergone a sudden accession of wealth.
I was referring to a possible reason why rich Muslims might want to help poor Muslims. Whether their "help" actually helps is irrelevant when we're talking about their motivation.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Recruiting Poster
Dr Adequate writes: Well in that case it's a recruiting poster with the slogan "Be A Terrorist And We'll Kill You" superimposed on a picture of the corpse of Bin Laden.
Exactly. When people want to die for their cause, killing them is not the way to defeat them. It's the way to encourage them.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Helping The Brethren
Dr Adequate writes: They don't "want to help poor Muslims", they want to carry out the will of God as they understand it.
I'm glad you have such complete inside information on what "they want".
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Recruiting Poster
Dr Adequate writes: ringo writes: When people want to die for their cause, killing them is not the way to defeat them.
And if the Nazis had thought they'd get 72 virgins if they died for Hitler, we should probably still have shot at them.
Non sequitur. The Nazis didn't want to die for their cause. They were reluctantly willing to risk their lives, just like the Allied troops were, just like the troops on both sides are in every war. In the case of Muslim terrorism, we have people who literally want to die. If you kill them, they win.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 144 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-17-2015 12:43 PM | | Dr Adequate has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 176 of 508 (772734)
11-18-2015 11:03 AM
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Reply to: Message 146 by Diomedes
11-17-2015 1:11 PM
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Re: A Few Details
Diomedes writes: Often times, we place political correctness on some sacrosanct pedestal and anyone that states something, even a basic fact, is immediately labeled as 'intolerant'.
No you're just channelling Faith. 
Diomedes writes: Europe's society is BETTER than that of Saudi Arabia.
That's a rather silly over-simplification. "Europe's society" is not monolithic. There are parts of Europe that are as bad as Saudi Arabia. Five minutes ago, there was a Communist bloc that was The Great Satan of the moment. Their secular values were called WORSE than religious hegemony at the time.
Diomedes writes: There is no debate here....
Yes there is.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 146 by Diomedes, posted 11-17-2015 1:11 PM | | Diomedes has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 177 of 508 (772735)
11-18-2015 11:04 AM
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Reply to: Message 147 by 1.61803
11-17-2015 1:34 PM
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Re: Recruiting Poster
~1.6 writes: Well they better get ready for some grade A encouragement in the coming weeks from France, Russia, and the USA.
And France, Russia and the USA had better get ready for wave after wave of new recruits and new terrorism.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 147 by 1.61803, posted 11-17-2015 1:34 PM | | 1.61803 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 212 by 1.61803, posted 11-18-2015 7:16 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: A Few Details
Dr Adequate writes: I was passionately and vocally against the Iraq war.
Good for you. What changed?
Dr Adequate writes: The question is: what should we do now?
We should avoid repeating the mistakes of Iraq. Defeating ISIS militarily will not put an end to terrorism any more than defeating Saddam Hussein did.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 183 of 508 (772748)
11-18-2015 11:56 AM
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Reply to: Message 182 by Percy
11-18-2015 11:50 AM
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Re: A Few Details
Percy writes: But what I would say is that we have created a monster that we may now have to slay, and that might require the very kind of indiscriminate killing we abhor.
We have created a monster and he is us. We can either win at all costs or we can honourably lose.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 182 by Percy, posted 11-18-2015 11:50 AM | | Percy has seen this message but not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: A Few Details
Dr Adequate writes: I also know for a fact that if we let ISIS get away with their shit then we're like the people who appeased the Nazis, or like how we let Pol Pot get away with killing 25% of Cambodians.
I'm not suggesting that we should let ISIS get away with anything. I'm suggesting that we shouldn't help them by doing their recruiting for them.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Helping The Brethren
Dr Adequate writes: I obtained this information by reading their public statements about what they want. It's not "inside information". It's what they say in their public statements.
And of course you trust them to be scrupulously honest. Our own governments "adjust" the truth to suit their motives but the bad guys would never do that, would they?
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: A Few Details
Dr Adequate writes: We don't behead people for being gay or for being Christian or for being the wrong kind of Muslim. Rape and slavery are not part of our ideology. We are not the monster.
We bomb civilians. We shouldn't be using our enemies as the yardstick for our own behaviour. We need to set a higher standard for ourselves. We are the only monster that we can control.
Dr Adequate writes: Even more if this is our fault, we cannot honorably lose. HONOR is not where we say: we fucked it up, so we must not lift a finger to put it right.
Honour is where we say: I won't rape a rapist and I won't torture a torturer.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 228 of 508 (772834)
11-19-2015 10:56 AM
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Reply to: Message 212 by 1.61803
11-18-2015 7:16 PM
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Re: Recruiting Poster
~1.6 writes: Do you think that if the US practiced complete pacifist isolationism that we would not be victims of terrorism?
No. I advocate keeping our hands clean for the sake of cleanliness. Cleanliness may have a cost.
~1.6 writes: They are bringing about their own destruction because this kind of idiotic mentality is self defeating. The world is not ready to go back to the middle ages and bow to sharia law.
IF they lose, it will be because they don't have the support of the Muslim world. Encouraging Muslims to support them is not the way to defeat them.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 212 by 1.61803, posted 11-18-2015 7:16 PM | | 1.61803 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 229 by 1.61803, posted 11-19-2015 12:04 PM | | ringo has replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 230 of 508 (772844)
11-19-2015 12:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 229 by 1.61803
11-19-2015 12:04 PM
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Re: Recruiting Poster
~1.6 writes: To late for that sorry but nice sentiment. We are in bed and there is a wet stain.
We don't have to wallow in filth. It's never too late to clean up our act.
~1.6 writes: They will lose because they do not have the support of the world.
They don't need the support of the world.
~1.6 writes: Once their leadership, money and ordinance runs out they will slither back into the crevices from whence they came to rebuild for another day.
Exactly. They will rebuild for another day.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 229 by 1.61803, posted 11-19-2015 12:04 PM | | 1.61803 has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 273 of 508 (773075)
11-24-2015 11:02 AM
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Reply to: Message 272 by dronestar
11-23-2015 4:45 PM
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Re: Once upon a time . . .
dronester writes: But, it seems most people prefer using more bombs.
You have to understand the difference between good capitalist factory-made bombs and those evil socialist home-made IEDs.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 272 by dronestar, posted 11-23-2015 4:45 PM | | dronestar has not replied |
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ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Message 349 of 508 (773415)
12-01-2015 11:53 AM
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Reply to: Message 348 by Tangle
12-01-2015 11:36 AM
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Tangle writes: THEY hold life cheap? THEY?
Yes they do. That's why they blow themselves and others of the same faith up.
Your irony detector is malfunctioning. The implication is that WE too hold life cheap; we just have a different price list: lives of other faiths are cheaper; lives of people standing beside terrorists are dirt cheap.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 348 by Tangle, posted 12-01-2015 11:36 AM | | Tangle has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 359 by Tangle, posted 12-01-2015 4:33 PM | | ringo has replied |
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