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Author | Topic: How do you define the word Evolution? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
"Although creationists frequently claim that there are no transitional fossils, the paleontological record tells a very different story."
Access denied | National Center for Science Education
Fossils with transitional morphology are not rare. Fossils illustrating the gradual origin of humans, horses, rhinos, whales, seacows, mammals, birds, tetrapods, and various major Cambrian "phyla" have been discovered and are well-known to scientists. Lots moreReligious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined:
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My definition of evolution is "LUCK and CHANCE" Nobody cares what your definition is. Scientists get to define the terms they use, not preachers who are 180 anti-science.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Theory: a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world; an organized system of accepted knowledge that applies in a variety of circumstances to explain a specific set of phenomena; theories can incorporate facts and laws and tested hypotheses. Theories do not grow up to be laws. Theories explain laws. Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Evolutionists, having hijacked the science of biology, like to think they own it and have re-defined it in their own image. But the truth is, ToE will only ever be an irrelevant little subset of real biology. ToE is like a parasite riding on the back of an elephant (true biology) - the parasite needs the elephant, but the elephant doesn't need the parasite. And creationists have invented the term "evolutionists" to describe anyone who studies a field of science whose results contradict their ancient tribal beliefs. What a joke!Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Evolution by genetic loss must eventually result in extinction. I would extend this to say that speciation is step towards extinction. That's a popular creationist view, entirely unsupported by the biological and genetic sciences. I suspect that that view stems from the religious belief in "the fall," which is also entirely unsupported by the biological and genetic sciences.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Can you substantiate that claim that creationists have invented the term "evolutionists"? This sounds like the discredited claim that Creationists invented the terms micro- and macroevolution. Perhaps if they didn't invent the term, creationists are pretty much the only ones using it now. And by that they mean anyone in the sciences whose results they disagree with.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined:
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A highschool-level of biology, some common sense, a nose for bs, respect for scientific rigour and a dose of honesty is all one needs to realise that ToE is, at the very least, a very suspect theory. You left out an unhealthy dose of creationism, as that's the primary impetus for doubting the theory of evolution. Once creationist belief has been inculcated in someone, evidence no longer matters.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
You can't just pick one you like and say "This is THE definition of evolution"; especially since it is such a poor one that even Creationists are willing to adopt it. And creationists have no say in the matter at all, being inherently anti-science. You wouldn't hire a plumber who busted up your pipes instead of fixing them, would you?Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined:
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Creationists don't reject anything that is useful in applied biology, so your claim that "creationists are ... inherently anti-science" is baseless. "Useful" science = fields that don't disprove our beliefs. Not useful science = everything else. You have made my case for me. Creationists think they can pick and choose from science, accepting some things and rejecting others for religious reasons. The fields they reject they do their best to undermine. We see that on a daily basis here, and we see it throughout the country in creationist's efforts take over school boards (Dover) and to mandate their beliefs in school text books (see the recent efforts in Texas, for example). (See posts from Faith and Davidjay for additional examples.) There is no way these efforts can be seen to be supporting science--they are clearly anti-science. You have even included the "good science vs. bad science" nonsense in your post, referring to "anything that is useful in applied biology." You clearly mean to exclude evolution, much of geology, genetics and a few related fields that disprove your beliefs as "science which is not useful."
Name one creationist belief that would prevent a creationist from becoming a competent professional in the field of applied biology. Young earth; global flood ca. 4350 years ago. If these beliefs are acted upon they impost a worldview that is completely at odds with the real-world evidence. Given her posts and beliefs, Faith would not be a very effective geologist, for example.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined:
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Creationists are logical and rational... You disprove that claim with every post you make here.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Model: a simplified representation designed to illuminate complex processes; a hypothetical description of a complex entity or process; a physical or mathematical representation of a process that can be used to predict some aspect of the process; a representation such that knowledge concerning the model offers insight about the entity modelled. A model, to be of any practical value, has to organize facts into a cohesive whole. If there are a lot of facts that contradict a model it is of little value.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr. |
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Creationists not only accept all scientific pricipals that have proven useful in applied science, they also accept all scientific theories that have been verified by observation and experiment. These facts don't support your hypothosis that creationists are "anti-scientific". "Useful in applied science" is not a valid criterion in science. "verified by observation and experiment" is not a valid criterion in science. In both cases creationists have attempted to make this distinction to separate the fields of science that they are OK with while condemning the ones that disprove their religious beliefs. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. Both use the same scientific method, and attempts by creationists to draw a distinction between the two is anti-science and based entirely on religious belief.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Memorizing a large set of facts does not lead to understanding. Finding the underlying structure of those facts does. Piling up facts is not science--science is facts-and-theories. Facts alone have limited use and lack meaning: a valid theory organizes them into far greater usefulness. Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
This means theories that aren't verified by observation and experiment lay outside the realm of science Nonsense. Some fields of science are not able to do experiments, but that does not prevent them from doing science.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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Coyote Member (Idle past 2136 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: |
Evolutionary biologist, on the other hand, don't concern themselves with the real world; their "job" is to promote atheist theology - to wit: prop up the utterly useless theory that all life evolved from a common ancestor. Hence their use of the word "evolved" when it's not necessary to. Statements like this reduce your credibility to about the vanishing point.Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
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