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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: The Totalitarian Leftist Tactics against the Right | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
JonF Member (Idle past 198 days) Posts: 6174 Joined:
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Lindsey Graham, well-known Republican war-hawk Senator, put it well:
"Anytime you're in a campaign and you get an offer from a foreign government to help your campaign, the answer is no." Setup or not, do you approve of Don Jr. attempting to get Russian government intelligence gained by spying on the US? Of course you do! IOIYAR.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I think it was unwise of him.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
It's no setup. Unless, of course, you have evidence of such. Until then a criminal investigation is required. Why would it matter if it was a setup? Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000
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Porosity Member (Idle past 2124 days) Posts: 158 From: MT, USA Joined: |
Why would it matter if it was a setup? It shouldn't matter. It would be like John claiming innocence, saying the cops set up my meeting with a twelve year old while her parents are out.
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JonF Member (Idle past 198 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
I think it was unwise of him Merely unwise? How about the legal implications.
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JonF Member (Idle past 198 days) Posts: 6174 Joined:
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Why would it matter if it was a setup? To rational humans, it wouldn't. Faith obviously thinks it matters. It's just the usual knee-jerk hater reaction when her heroes have feet of clay. Probably criminal clay. But, hey, IOIYAR.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17828 Joined: Member Rating: 2.5
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Even if it was a set-up Trump jr loved - his word - the idea of getting illegal help from the Russian government. There was no element of coercion or anything else that would rise to the level of entrapment . Just the offer which he happily accepted, along with - it seems - Kushner and Manafort, both of whom were at the meeting.
And he lied about the purpose of the meeting when it was first raised. Which seems to be something of a habit in the Trump campaign. Spin it how you like there is no doubt that this reflects very badly on the Trump campaign.
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JonF Member (Idle past 198 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
And he did not list the meeting on his application for a security clearance. And campaign representatives, including Mike pence, steadfastly denied any meetings between campaign staff and Russians.
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
How about the legal implications. Legally, there may not be much here. According to the only one talking about the meeting itself (namely, Donald Jr), it turned out that the whole meeting was to talk about the Magnitsky Act. I doubt that "intent to received hacked emails" rises to the same level of prosecutability as "conspiracy to murder", but I may be wrong. More evidence may come to alight about what actually took place in the meeting itself that may lead to an indictment, but right now I'm thinking this is going to be a legal "nothing burger". Far more important, of course, is the moral and ethical implications of going into this meeting. Imagine the Republicans' reaction if it was the Democrats that were meeting with a foreign representative (not that anyone can accuse US conservatives of moral consistency). And this may end up being relevant to other parts of the Russia investigations going on now. But I may be wrong; I don't spend my entire day glued to news sources, so it would be easy for relevant information to slip by me.Patriotism is the excuse that countries give to themselves for their failures. — Stephen Marche
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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The issue is "What did the President know and when did he know it?"
Seems we have been down this path a few times during my lifetime. Edited by jar, : fix sub-title
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JonF Member (Idle past 198 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
According to the only one talking about the meeting itself (namely, Donald Jr), it turned out that the whole meeting was to talk about the Magnitsky Act. According to the emails he posted, he expected to meet an agent of the Russian government who had incriminating information about Hillary and receive that information. If that information is determined to be something of value, soliciting such information from a foreign national is a violation of the Federal Election Campaign Act. There are differing legal opinions on this particular case but it's definitely worth testing in a court of law. Of course not mentioning his meeting on his original application for a security clearance is a felony.
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
There are differing legal opinions on this particular case but it's definitely worth testing in a court of law. To test it, there has to be a prosecutor willing to press charges. I admit this is only a guess, but unless something more comes up, I doubt that will happen. 'Course something more might come up as this is investigated further, but right now I'm seeing the main value of this as part of the bigger picture of how involved together the Trump campaign and the Russians were. -
Of course not mentioning his meeting on his original application for a security clearance is a felony. I thought Donald Jr was the one designated to stay out of government to look after the businesses? Am I confusing him with Eric?Patriotism is the excuse that countries give to themselves for their failures. — Stephen Marche
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Hillary did a lot of colluding with Russia but that's being ignored. The dirt one might get on her by talking to a Russian representative is evidence for that. Trump wouldn't have been colluding, he would have been looking for evidence that Hillary colluded. Which she did, which is being ignored. The Russian lawyer has been photographed at anti-Trump rallies and Soros events. The whole thing is a set-up to take the heat off Hillary and smear Trump with her crimes.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17828 Joined: Member Rating: 2.5 |
quote: Anything that you wouldn't roundly approve of if she was a Republican ? You didn't have any problem with Sessions' meetings with the Russians (and the main problem was misleading Congress, not the meetings themselves)
quote: How do you know that there was any real dirt to offer ? And if there was how do you know it wasn't obtained by hacking and nothing to do with Russia ?
quote: Trump Jr went in with the intent of getting dirt from the Russian government without any real concern as to what that dirt might be. Certainly looks as if he was ready to collude.
quote: Even if that is true there is no evidence that she had anything to do with the alleged set-up.
quote: Not much of a set-up. All Trump Jr or Kushner or Manafort had to do was to refuse the meeting. They weren't given any "dirt" - even fake "dirt" - which would have made the situation much worse. And you know reporting what they did is not a smear.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I can't even keep track of Hillary's crimes, including selling American info to Russia for money. Sessions' contact had nothing to do with campaign issues, they were standard contacts with diplomats that all US politicians have. There was nothing he was required to report, or would even have occurred to him to report.
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