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Author Topic:   The Trump Presidency
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6531
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 3.6


(3)
Message 2506 of 2666 (840398)
09-28-2018 6:02 PM
Reply to: Message 2505 by Percy
09-28-2018 9:18 AM


Re: Republicans Stunning lack of Honesty, Integrity and Sensitivity`
Justice Kavanaugh would not be convicted and removed from the bench, but just the impeachment itself would mean that he would be under great pressure to recuse himself from numerous cases involving women, including anything to do with Roe v. Wade.

You think so? 'Cause maybe you're right, but, me, I've been thinking for a while, "Man, if he's confirmed, he's gonna be giving some pay-back."


We weaken our greatness when we confuse our patriotism with tribal rivalries that have sown resentment and hatred and violence in all the corners of the globe. -- John McCain

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2505 by Percy, posted 09-28-2018 9:18 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2507 by Percy, posted 09-29-2018 10:21 AM Chiroptera has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 2507 of 2666 (840411)
09-29-2018 10:21 AM
Reply to: Message 2506 by Chiroptera
09-28-2018 6:02 PM


Re: Republicans Stunning lack of Honesty, Integrity and Sensitivity`
Chiroptera writes:

I've been thinking for a while, "Man, if he's confirmed, he's gonna be giving some pay-back."

Yeah, just a peach of a guy.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2506 by Chiroptera, posted 09-28-2018 6:02 PM Chiroptera has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2509 by Chiroptera, posted 09-29-2018 11:40 AM Percy has responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 2508 of 2666 (840413)
09-29-2018 10:30 AM


Democrats Planning to Examine Trump Tax Returns
From Democrats planning to examine Trump’s tax returns after the midterms:

quote:
The years-old mystery of what’s in President Donald Trump’s tax returns will likely quickly unravel if Democrats win control of at least one chamber of Congress.

Democrats, especially in the House, are quietly planning on using an obscure law that will enable them to examine the president’s tax filings without his permission.

The nearly 100-year-old statute allows the chairmen of Congress’ tax committees to look at anyone’s returns, and Democrats say they intend to use that power to help answer a long list of questions about Trump’s finances. Many also want to use it to make public confidential information about Trump’s taxes that he’s steadfastly refused to release.


--Percy


    
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6531
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 3.6


(5)
Message 2509 of 2666 (840419)
09-29-2018 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 2507 by Percy
09-29-2018 10:21 AM


More Kavanaugh analysis
From the New York Times:

At Times, Kavanaugh’s Defense Misleads or Veers Off Point

Just what it says on the tin. This article takes some of the statements and claims that Kavanaugh made in his defense and shows how these particular ones were either untrue or have very different implications when examined in context.

My take-a-way:

The allegations being made against Kavanaugh are much more credible;

he is more a partisan conservative than an impartial arbiter of the law; and

he really is a stereotypical "politician', ready to bend or stretch the truth if he believes it will advance his cause.


We weaken our greatness when we confuse our patriotism with tribal rivalries that have sown resentment and hatred and violence in all the corners of the globe. -- John McCain

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2507 by Percy, posted 09-29-2018 10:21 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2510 by Percy, posted 09-29-2018 12:27 PM Chiroptera has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


(3)
Message 2510 of 2666 (840429)
09-29-2018 12:27 PM
Reply to: Message 2509 by Chiroptera
09-29-2018 11:40 AM


Re: More Kavanaugh analysis
Chiroptera writes:

My take-a-way:

The allegations being made against Kavanaugh are much more credible;

he is more a partisan conservative than an impartial arbiter of the law; and

he really is a stereotypical "politician', ready to bend or stretch the truth if he believes it will advance his cause.

Yes, yes, yes. There is no honor among thieves or politicians. They all become so focused on molding their message to what will get them enough votes that they become unable to distinguish truth from fiction or lies.

But it is inevitable that this be so. Those that don't focus on molding their message to get votes don't get elected. Even the politicians who seem most likely to take stances on the merits and what's right rather than being blind vote junkies, like Jeff Flake, Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski and Bob Corker, vote with Trump over 90% of the time.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2509 by Chiroptera, posted 09-29-2018 11:40 AM Chiroptera has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2511 by Phat, posted 09-30-2018 9:53 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Phat
Member
Posts: 11597
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2511 of 2666 (840455)
09-30-2018 9:53 AM
Reply to: Message 2510 by Percy
09-29-2018 12:27 PM


Re: More Kavanaugh analysis


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2510 by Percy, posted 09-29-2018 12:27 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 2512 of 2666 (840491)
09-30-2018 6:46 PM


Trump Lies Again
Not that it will surprise anyone, but Trump has lied again. He claimed that the FBI probe of Kavanaugh's statements to the judiciary committee would be unfettered when in reality the White House is specifying that it be narrowly focused. Only a handful of people will be interviewed, and while no list has been made public it seems unlikely that it will include Julie Swetnick. Kavanaugh's drinking history will not be investigated.

On the weekly Sunday morning programs Trump puppets Kellyanne Conway and Sarah Sanders denied reports that the investigation would be limited in scope, but Trump lap dog Senator Lindsey Graham said that Senator Jeff Flake, Senator Susan Collins and Senator Lisa Murkowski "wanted a limited review," despite no evidence or news reports of any of them saying any such thing.

Obviously the primary Republican interest is in getting their man on the Supreme Court and not on coming as close to the truth as possible.

Source: FBI's Kavanaugh investigation narrow in scope

--Percy


Replies to this message:
 Message 2513 by Chiroptera, posted 09-30-2018 7:26 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2514 by Phat, posted 10-02-2018 10:27 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Chiroptera
Member
Posts: 6531
From: Oklahoma
Joined: 09-28-2003
Member Rating: 3.6


(5)
Message 2513 of 2666 (840492)
09-30-2018 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2512 by Percy
09-30-2018 6:46 PM


Re: Trump Lies Again
Obviously the primary Republican interest is in getting their man on the Supreme Court and not on coming as close to the truth as possible.

Yes, but I have to wonder why they're rushing on the creep Kavanaugh. Trump is going to be President until January 2019 at least, and most people think Republican control of the Senate isn't in danger over the midterm elections. It seems that they have all the time in the world to withdraw Kavanaugh's nomination and try again with another political hack, but with better vetting to avoid the baggage.

I'm guessing that there's a lot of outrage among the conservatives that people would dare push back against them on anything, and this push to get Kavanaugh confirmed has a lot to do with an open display of their power: "we can do what we want, so fuck you all."


We weaken our greatness when we confuse our patriotism with tribal rivalries that have sown resentment and hatred and violence in all the corners of the globe. -- John McCain

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2512 by Percy, posted 09-30-2018 6:46 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 11597
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2514 of 2666 (840559)
10-02-2018 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 2512 by Percy
09-30-2018 6:46 PM


Re: Trump Lies Again
Percy writes:

Obviously the primary Republican interest is in getting their man on the Supreme Court and not on coming as close to the truth as possible.

And it looks as if they have the power to do it! Scary....who on earth would want this man as a Supreme Court Justice? I fear for our future...

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2512 by Percy, posted 09-30-2018 6:46 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 2515 by ringo, posted 10-02-2018 11:37 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2516 by marc9000, posted 10-04-2018 11:06 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 15750
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 2515 of 2666 (840560)
10-02-2018 11:37 AM
Reply to: Message 2514 by Phat
10-02-2018 10:27 AM


Re: Trump Lies Again
Phat writes:

....who on earth would want this man as a Supreme Court Justice?


True Believers, people who believe in their dogma whether it works or not - i.e. people who put faith before reality.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2514 by Phat, posted 10-02-2018 10:27 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
marc9000
Member
Posts: 949
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009
Member Rating: 1.9


Message 2516 of 2666 (840775)
10-04-2018 11:06 AM
Reply to: Message 2514 by Phat
10-02-2018 10:27 AM


Re: Trump Lies Again
Scary....who on earth would want this man as a Supreme Court Justice? I fear for our future...

What decision do you fear he would make that would threaten our future? What decision has he made during any of his past positions that you don't agree with?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2514 by Phat, posted 10-02-2018 10:27 AM Phat has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2517 by Percy, posted 10-04-2018 4:55 PM marc9000 has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


(2)
Message 2517 of 2666 (840846)
10-04-2018 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 2516 by marc9000
10-04-2018 11:06 AM


The Kavanaugh Nomination
Kavanaugh's past decisions and his statements and responses to questions before the Judiciary Committee indicate that he has an unlimited view of presidential power (i.e., he isn't a big believer in checks and balances), that he may not view Roe v. Wade as settled law, that he may have lied about his drinking in high school and college, that he may have sexually abused women, and that he lacks judicial temperament.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2516 by marc9000, posted 10-04-2018 11:06 AM marc9000 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2518 by marc9000, posted 10-04-2018 8:03 PM Percy has responded

    
marc9000
Member
Posts: 949
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009
Member Rating: 1.9


(1)
Message 2518 of 2666 (840861)
10-04-2018 8:03 PM
Reply to: Message 2517 by Percy
10-04-2018 4:55 PM


Re: The Kavanaugh Nomination
Kavanaugh's past decisions and his statements and responses to questions before the Judiciary Committee indicate that he has an unlimited view of presidential power (i.e., he isn't a big believer in checks and balances)

"Unlimited view of presidential power" is too harsh of a description - many of his past writings and experiences happened while Clinton and Obama were in office. What he favors are limits to distractions which would keep a president from effectively doing his job.

quote:
He said Congress should pass a law temporarily protecting presidents from such distractions in office.

Clinton, for example, “could have focused on Osama bin Laden without being distracted by the Paula Jones sexual harassment case and its criminal investigation offshoots,” Kavanaugh wrote in the 2009
Minnesota Law Review article.


https://www.seattletimes.com/...l-powers-could-be-flashpoint

Seems to me Democrats would agree with that, many Republicans do - I do. Also from that article;

quote:
In a 1998 article in the Georgetown Law Journal, Kavanaugh wrote that Congress should give the president the ability to fire special counsels, an opinion that Democrats have highlighted in the hours since he was nominated Monday evening.

Kavanaugh’s reasoning, however, was not to protect presidents but to make them more accountable. He wrote that presidents can complain that independent counsels are politically motivated while implying they are powerless to do anything about it. Giving the president firing power would “force the president and his surrogates to put up or shut up.”


And;

quote:
It’s part of their obsession with Russia, and the president,” Thune said, noting that Kavanaugh wrote the article proposing presidential exemptions from lawsuits and investigations when President Barack Obama was in office.

His opinions on presidential power are largely non-partisan, but today's news media is largely succeeding in covering that up. They're trying to make him all about protecting Trump in the immediate future, and that's far from the truth.

that he may not view Roe v. Wade as settled law,

Yes, that's a never ending political division.

that he may have lied about his drinking in high school and college, that he may have sexually abused women,

A lot of independent swing voters in the country must be asking themselves; "The party of Bill Clinton in the 90's, the party of Moveon.org etc, is concerned about 36 year old school parties from school children? This is going to affect his rulings? I actually kind of hope he's voted down. I think the Democrats are going to get a trouncing in the upcoming elections anyway, but his being viciously destroyed like this could make it even worse for them.

and that he lacks judicial temperament.

That's a recent invention from the left, as if judicial decisions are going to invoke the same emotion from him as the grilling and personal attacks he's been fielding lately. As you might remember from back in 1991, Clarence Thomas got pretty emotional at the racism displayed against him by Democrats at that time, and hasn't shown similar emotion since in his duties on the Supreme court.

But you've answered my question, there don't seem to be any detailed specifics, just generalizations - from a political party that makes no secret that it will obstruct anyone Trump nominates, anyone. Forget the good of the country, forget the taxpayers who have to foot the bill for this charade, it's ONLY about obstruction. We'll see how these elections go, I'm 64, and I'm beginning to think that I won't have to worry about Democrat control of either the house or senate for the rest of my life. It's a good feeling.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2517 by Percy, posted 10-04-2018 4:55 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2520 by Percy, posted 10-05-2018 9:17 PM marc9000 has responded

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 14555
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 2519 of 2666 (840929)
10-05-2018 3:04 PM


The case against the Trump Foundation
As presented in an Opposition to Trump’s Motion to Dismiss.

NY AG

Pretty damning - certainly enough to survive dismissal.


    
Percy
Member
Posts: 17973
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 2520 of 2666 (840947)
10-05-2018 9:17 PM
Reply to: Message 2518 by marc9000
10-04-2018 8:03 PM


Re: The Kavanaugh Nomination
marc9000 writes:

quote:
He said Congress should pass a law temporarily protecting presidents from such distractions in office.

Clinton, for example, “could have focused on Osama bin Laden without being distracted by the Paula Jones sexual harassment case and its criminal investigation offshoots,” Kavanaugh wrote in the 2009 Minnesota Law Review article.


https://www.seattletimes.com/...l-powers-could-be-flashpoint

Seems to me Democrats would agree with that, many Republicans do - I do.

I'm an independent, and I believe no one should be above the law.

His opinions on presidential power are largely non-partisan,...

Kavanaugh revealed himself to be completely partisan during his tirade against Democrats on September 27. Some excerpts (full text here):

quote:
Since my nomination in July, there has been a frenzy on the left to come up with something, anything, to block my confirmation.
...
The behavior of several of the Democratic members of this committee at the hearing a few weeks ago was an embarrassment...This first allegation was held in secret for weeks by a Democratic member of this committee and by staff.
...
This whole two-week effort has been a calculated and orchestrated political hit fueled with apparent pent-up anger about President Trump and the 2016 election, fear that has been unfairly stoked about my judicial record, revenge on behalf of the Clintons, and millions of dollars in money from outside left-wing opposition groups.

Moving on:

and that he lacks judicial temperament.

That's a recent invention from the left,...

Actually that's what Judge Kavanaugh displayed in that self same tirade from September 27.

But you've answered my question, there don't seem to be any detailed specifics, just generalizations - from a political party that makes no secret that it will obstruct anyone Trump nominates, anyone. Forget the good of the country, forget the taxpayers who have to foot the bill for this charade, it's ONLY about obstruction. We'll see how these elections go, I'm 64, and I'm beginning to think that I won't have to worry about Democrat control of either the house or senate for the rest of my life. It's a good feeling.

You sound very partisan. I don't want us to elect those who care only for what is best for their party. I think we should elect those who care most about the best interests of the country, independent of party affiliation. I don't think we have many of that kind of person serving in state and federal office today.

AbE: In case there's any doubt that Kavanaugh's tirade raised serious questions about his objectivity and judicial temperament, based on that testimony the American Bar Association has decided to reopen its evaluation of Kavanaugh.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : AbE.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2518 by marc9000, posted 10-04-2018 8:03 PM marc9000 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2521 by marc9000, posted 10-07-2018 3:24 PM Percy has responded

    
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