Prophecy of Messiah: Isaiah 7

If someone thinks that Isaiah 7 & 8 are prophetic of the Messiah, about the only possible conclusion is that Jesus was not the Messiah.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Why does it mean that? What about Ruth? Why would God be restricted to any specific pool of talent?

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

The biggest issue related to trying to make Isaiah 7 fit Jesus is that it can only be done through an act of Wilfull Ignorance. To make it fit you have to pick just one single verse while you wilfully ignore all of the rest of Isaiah 7 & 8.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Long long ago, during a great storm on the seas, a cruise boat broke up. One man who had been thrown overboard drifted for days on the open seas. Finally when he was near death he washed up on the shores of a tropical island.As he regained conciousness and staggered to his feet a group of natives rushed streaming from the treeline, spears glistening in the sun. They surrounded him and at spearpoint prodded and pushed him back towards the treeline where a large boiling pot could be seen.Just as that moment the sky darkened as a great bird flew over, and shit. The bird poop fell, striking the man and covering him with wet, smelly goo. Instantly all the natives fell to the ground, heads bowed in reverance and all chanting, "Foo, Foo, Foo".They jumped up and now cheerfully led the man inland, all hostility gone, and seated him at the head of a great feast. They fed him the finest foods, he was surrounded by the most beautiful women while the natives serenaded him with songs and chants.Later, when he found the bird poop hardening, and could stand the smell no longer, he wandered back down to the shore where he washed the bird poop off.And dropped down dead.The moral of the story, is "If the Foo Shits, wear it!." I make a general statement and you claim the garment fits you perfectly.

​

Let the audience decide.fixed some spelling errors and probably added a fwe.This message has been edited by jar, 03-20-2006 11:59 AM

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

I will be happy to once again show that it is only through Wilfull Ignorance that Isaiah 7 can be taken to refer to Jesus. All it takes is a reading of what is there.When during Jesus life did the King of Assyria invade Israel.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Give it a try. This thread is about Isaiah, 7 & 8. Let's step through it and see if you can support your assertion.Perhaps you can show where during Jesus young life or when in Jesus life he is too young to know right from wrong? I'm sorry, but like most of the Messianic prophecies, Isaiah too requires an act of Wilfull Ignorance to be validated.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

if someone is going to claim that Isaiah refers to Jesus. When during Jesus life did the King of Assyria shave the Hebrews heads, the hair of their legs and take off their beards?There is simply no way that anyone who reads Isaiah can see Isaiah 7 refering to Jesus without ignoring all of the rest of the story.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Ah, but it is wilfull ignorance buz.Are you willing to step through Isaiah 7, line by line and verse by verse? Isaiah 7 does not and can not apply to Jesus. It matters not when "in that day" applies to. the content of Isaiah 7 cannot be applied to Jesus. But it's pretty damn clear about what will happen "In that Day" and none of the things mentioned happened during Jesus lifetime. You are ignoring what is actually written in Isaiah, buz. Not really. What God says is he's pissed at the House of David not specifically Ahaz. What Ahaz does is exactly what everyone is told to do, what you and others constantly preach against, and that is testing or tempting GOD. and in GOD's response He does not say, Ahaz, you pissed me off!", but instead says that the House of David is pissing him off... How can you ignore what is written? Come on buz. GOD says he will give a child and the name of the child will be "God is with us" is a generic. Again, you are ignoring what IS written and adding in what you want it to mean. Let's look at the rest and see if that child can be Jesus. However he clearly and repeatedly says what will happen in that day, the day being the life of the child. So let's look at what is written. Before the child will know to refuse evil.Are you saying that Jesus did not know good from evil and was capable of sin? If Isaiah 7 is speaking of Jesus then Jesus is not divine and learned right from wrong just like everyone else. Again, this is far from the enemies being defeated, it clearly says that the King of Assyria (note, no Romans) will will be punishing the House of David. The time is pretty clear. We are not talking about Jesus but rather a punishment of the House of David itself and the punishment is by Assyria. I will be glad to walk through 8 & 9 with you and show that again, only through wilfull ignorance can they be taken to point to Jesus.Start a thread on them.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

No edit buz. It's fact. Sorry if your sensitivities get ruffled. Reality has a way of doing that. But please note, that I actually backed up my assertions with concrete examples.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

No problem buz. The record is there for all to read. You started the thread about Isaiah 7. I have be dealing with Isaiah 7. It is impossible to consider that Isaiah 7 refers to Jesus unless you ignore all of the other verses. In support I included some examples of verses that must be ignored.The record is there. Read Isaiah 7 and this thread.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Simply repeating things that have been refuted doesn't make them right. If you read those sections you will see that they do not refer to Jesus, and I even gave you specific quotes so that you could see them in context. Please point out where that will apply to the life of Jesus? If the statement refers to Jesus then Jesus did not know right from wrong and had to learn that just like every other child, he was just another normal kid and not something special. buz, to try to shoehorn and force Isaiah 7 into some prophecy of Jesus you need to ignore all the other verses in Isaiah 7.Here is the problem buz. When folk try to use stuff like this to convince non-believers of the reality of Jesus message, it actually drives them away. If you believe that there really is a Gospel, good news to share, dragging out things like this which are obviously false, ludacrous even, doesn't help. They read Isaiah 7 and their immediate response is "This is nonsense. It doesn't refer to Jesus at all. If this is what they call evidence then it's pretty obvious that Christianity is simply a meeting place for folk that are not capable of critical thinking or even independant thought. Guess the whole idea of Christianity can just be ignored as a joke."If Christians want to spread the Good News, they need to throw out all these simplistic, ridiculous attempts to con folk. You aren't going to convince anyone who actually bothers to read the book, and you are going to continue to alienate the very people you are trying to attract. Start actually spreading the message.
GOD has forgiven ALL mankind. Not just Christian, not just Jews, but everyone, Atheist, Agnostic, Christian, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist, Taoist, Satanist, Wiccan, everyone.

​

GOD also has asked us to try to do what is right. Love GOD and love others as you love yourself.

​

It really is as simple as that.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

even ignoring parts of the verse and then twisting what is actually said to fit YOUR interpretation. That is unbelievable buz. but what the verse actually says is Why did you wilfully ignore "But before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right,..."? That alone shows that it is not about Jesus, unless you think Jesus just another child that had to learn right from wrong just like every other kid. but buz wilfully leaves out the rest of that verse. When during Jesus lifetime did the House of David get invaded by the king of Assyria? In this assertion you not only cherry pick words out of two verses but change the meaning totally. What Isaiah 18-19 actually say is: It actually says that the flies and bees will come from Egypt and Assyria and afflict the House of David. How is that a reference to Jesus? Again, that is simply NOT what the bible says. Here is verse 20 so folk can read what is actually there. Buz, it does not say that the Assyrians will have shaven heads and hair but that GOD will use the king of Assyria to shave hair from the legs, head and beard of the House of David. Now how does that apply to Jesus?This is getting tiresome but one final example of how you are perverting what is actually in Isaiah 7.You say: But again, that is not at all what verse 16 says. Once again, here is verse 16 for all to read. First, note that the boy does not know right from wrong. Are you saying that Jesus had to learn right from wrong just like every normal child? In addition, it says these things are going to happen during the childs lifetime, after his birth but before he grows up. And it is not Assyria that will be laid waste but the House of David.Buz, not one of the things that you assert hold up when one actually reads the bible, none, zero, zip, nada, nyet.This message has been edited by jar, 03-19-2006 02:22 PM

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

I don't think it is anymore reason to dismiss Jesus as Lord and Savior than buz's misuse of Isaiah.The Map is not the Territory and the Bible is not GOD. The authors and redactors of Matthew were building a franchise and just as in any advertising, sometimes spurious claims are made.This message has been edited by jar, 03-19-2006 01:28 PM

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well, that's a problem for those who think that GOD wrote the Bible, but has nothing to do with either Christianity or a belief in GOD.The Bible is filled with inconsistencies, mutually exclusive passages, errors of fact and omissions from beginning to end. It's a book, actually an anthology of anthologies with countless unnamed authors, editors and redactors. This is not a problem for most Christians and it is only those who try mental gymnatstics and outright twisting of what is written as seen in Message 184 that have problems. Unfortunately, their games simply serve to drive anyone who uses critical thinking away from the real word and message of the Bible.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

The actual texts from Isaiah 7 are included in my Message 186 for all to read.The readers can decide who is being insulting here.I notice that you never include the texts but rather just quotemine them ignoring parts that refute your position.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion