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Author | Topic: A question of numbers (one for the maths fans) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
riVeRraT writes: I don't care what you call it, you can't have any of my pie If 1/3 of a pie is only 60 degrees, we can each have 3/3. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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Iblis Member (Idle past 3926 days) Posts: 663 Joined: |
You can't subtract .9999999.... logically. That assumes infinity has an end. Sure you can 9.99etc = 9 + .99etc0.99etc = 0 + .99etc 9 - 0 = 9.99etc - .99etc = 0 9 + 0 = 9
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 446 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
Since when is etc a number?
Do me a favor, can you write out the whole number for me, so we can do the equation? Edited by riVeRraT, : No reason given.
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Iblis Member (Idle past 3926 days) Posts: 663 Joined: |
Since when is etc a number? Abbreviation for et cetera, that's Latin for "&shit" Also, what kind of pie?
write out the whole number for me Which one, 10 or 1? Edited by Iblis, : autistic chat
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
You can't subtract .9999999 Oh yes you can!
That assumes infinity has an end. Oh no it doesn't!
9.999999 -.999999 = 8.999991
Surely you mean 9? You have to subtract more than 1 to get 8.999991. If we have 9.999999... then you need to propose the number 8.9999999...1 (an infinite number of 9s followed by a 1!), which would assume infinity has an end, where a 1 is located. That's crazy talk! It's quite a provocative piece of maths, it feels very naughty don't you think? More here.
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fallacycop Member (Idle past 5551 days) Posts: 692 From: Fortaleza-CE Brazil Joined: |
riVeRraT writes: You can't subtract it long hand, one digit at a time. But what is to prevent us from subtracting all digits at once? ever heard of math recursion?
You can't subtract .9999999.... logically. That assumes infinity has an end.
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fallacycop Member (Idle past 5551 days) Posts: 692 From: Fortaleza-CE Brazil Joined: |
CK writes: Are you planning on explaining why you posted that question?
In this first post - you will get nothing from me but a question - why I have asked the question we can discuss later once we have had some discussion about it.
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ikabod Member (Idle past 4523 days) Posts: 365 From: UK Joined: |
no they are spelt differently , using .999999999 in place of 1 on your tax form will result in a penalty payment , and any way you have not stated your units .
otherwise you are playing with meaningless symbols . to paraphrase your "proofs"x=0.999999... 10x=9.999999... 10x-x = 9.999999... - 0.999999... 9x = 9 Therefore x=1 therefore thus x-1.0000000000 =0.0000000000000000000000000................ where x=1or 0.999999999..... - 1 = 0.11111111111111111111111111111111 ........ where x=0.99999999999999999............... mind you for you corporate accounts it might help with your negative proof situation ...which is it ????????? Edited by ikabod, : opss pressed submit by mistake
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cavediver Member (Idle past 3674 days) Posts: 4129 From: UK Joined: |
riVeRraT writes:
Oh yes you can! You can't subtract .9999999 ACtually, riVeRraT has a point. You have not demonstrated that the entities you are attempting to subtract exist. And in constructivism, they don't. Not that I'm even remotely a constructivist, but it should be recognised.
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
ACtually, riVeRraT has a point. You have not demonstrated that the entities you are attempting to subtract exist. rR has a point in that he stated it can't be done. I have the same strength of point in that I said it can. That's as advanced as the debate is right now
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cavediver Member (Idle past 3674 days) Posts: 4129 From: UK Joined: |
Since when is etc a number? Good point. Mathematics deals with far more than the usual numbers (an representations of numbers) that we meet in everyday experience. It is more the logical manipulation of symbols, some of which relate to the numbers of our experience. Some symbols appear to have no correspondance to our experience, but certain manipulations bring them back to more everyday objects. Take for example i, the sqrt of -1. It has no real (everday) meaning as you would understand it, except that i^4 = 1, which ties it down to things we can understand. Similarly with the infinite strings of digits that make up recurring decimals and irrational numbers.
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
0.999999999..... - 1 = 0.11111111111111111111111111111111 ........ That would imply that 0.999999999... + 0.11111111111.... is 1. Actually that bit of maths gets you 1.1111111111111..... Doing it in fractions: 9x1⁄9 - 1 = 0 Your maths '0.999999999..... - 1 = 0.11111111111111111111111111111111 ........' would look like this: 9x1⁄9 - 1 = 1⁄9 That leads to the unusual concept of 9⁄9 + 1⁄9 = 9⁄9
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CK Member (Idle past 4158 days) Posts: 3221 Joined: |
Drugs.
Oh wait that's not it - It's because I saw this: Credit Scores, Reports & History | Equifax UK
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
ACtually, riVeRraT has a point. You have not demonstrated that the entities you are attempting to subtract exist. And in constructivism, they don't. If 0.99999... doesn't exist, then isn't the statement 0.9999....=1 vacuously true? Maybe I'm just thinking about it too much?
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cavediver Member (Idle past 3674 days) Posts: 4129 From: UK Joined: |
If 0.99999... doesn't exist, then isn't the statement 0.9999....=1 vacuously true? Hmmm, I'm not sure of your logic there. You can simply define the symbol .999999... to be 1, but that sort of defeats the object. 1 divided by 3 yields .3333333..., and as a physical (constructable) process never yields the precise 1/3. We would like to imagine the process continuing to infinity to make the answer precise and then treat these infinite strings as simple continuations of the finite decimals, obeying the same operations. One must then ensure that these infinite strings remain consistent under these operations. Fortunately, they are But the constructivist will never believe you becasue you can never produce one!
Maybe I'm just thinking about it too much? One can never think about maths too much
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